How do you record your rides? Finding inconsistencies in various apps

[Tricia]

When @EricG posted that I was faster than Phil on Strava I had to scratch my head and then go look at Strava because I didn't believe it. I am out there with him and I know he's way ahead of me, having to wait on a regular basis.
From the MTB 2020 thread:

looks like your slightly faster than Phil though.. he needs to push the button harder..lol.

What's funny is, we rode the same trail but have differnet mileage and different speeds, and he was waiting for me at intersections because I am considerably slower than he is.

Circling back now that I've got a cup of coffee in me.

Strava, MTB Project, Trailforks, Apple Health, Garmin, Fitbit... to name a few. So many options to record a ride, hike, or swim.

I have an Apple watch, have used Trailforks, and occasionally remember to start Strava.
I have also recorded on more than one app to compare the information that they record, which usually comes out with different results.
Here is a screen shot of the same ride with my Strava, @Philpug's Strava, and my Trailforks record.
Phil and I were on the exact same ride. He was having to stop and wait for me regularly, so I'm baffled why his time was so different than mine.
According to Trailforks, loging in through Pinkbike, they pull their data from my Strava, so I'm kinda cracking up - why is TF different than Strava?

Then there is the new bike computer Bosch e-Bike Connect.
*mine is in two segments because I accidently knocked the computer off the bracket when I stopped for hydration so it started a second segment.
Me, 15.26 Miles, 1:51 Time, average speed 8.1 mph
Phil 16.06 Miles, 1:45 Time, average speed 9.2 mph
Strava says I was faster than Phil with an average speed of 7.1
Mine:

Phil's

Then there is Apple Heath and e-Bike Connect on the same ride:

How can all this technology be so far off from one another when I'm using the same device to record?

​

**This is not a complaint, because I'm enjoying my rides no matter what the data says but its kind of funny to me.
I will probably start using Strava more consistently and keep it in the Pugski Club.

 

[Rudi Riet]

Question: is auto-pause setup on either of your GPS units? On most GPS bike computers, a threshold can be set for auto-pause (e.g. speed less than 0.5 mph). What I see in the difference in recording is that Phil's GPS isn't auto-pausing.

The elevation differences are likely due to barometric altimeter versus GPS interpolation of topo maps.

The distance differences are harder to pinpoint.

FWIW, here are my GPS recording setups, in descending order of priority:

Garmin Edge 520 (auto-pause set to <0.5 mph, recording interval set to 1 second, GPS+GLONASS, paired to Garmin ANT+ speed and cadence sensors and a Wahoo ANT+/BLE heart rate strap, BLE paired to my iPhone for LiveTrack and uploading)

Garmin Edge 500 (same auto-pause and recording intervals, GPS only, paired to the three aforementioned sensors, can't pair to iPhone as no BLE on this older unit)

Xoss G+ (no way to calibrate auto-pause but pauses well, 1 second recording interval, GPS+GLONASS+Galileo+Baidu, paired to all sensors and to iPhone for upload and config of computer)

iPhone X with Strava app (sadly can no longer pair with Wahoo HR strap due to Strava dropping support)

iPhone X with RideWithGPS app (used only occasionally)

A few observations:

The Edge 520 and Xoss track a lot more accurately than the Edge 500 due to multi-system triangulation. This matters in areas with deep tree cover or lots of tall buildings (or if you live near sensitive government facilities, purposeful obfuscation of GPS' system).

LiveTrack on the Edge 520 drains both the computer and phone battery much faster due to constant communication between both units.

The Strava and RWGPS apps on the phone are really battery savvy.

RWGPS app is great for navigation even if you don't have the phone mounted on the handlebar, as it gives detailed audio prompts with street names.

Tracking on a smartphone or smartwatch is made more accurate if you're within cellular range, as these units will use cell tower triangulation to help refine location (especially helpful if the phone is shielded by your body or stored in a leg pocket).

Etc., etc....

Note that I seldom ever have more than one method of recording going at once. I'm not DC Rainmaker, after all.

 

[Tricia]

Note that I seldom ever have more than one method of recording going at once. I'm not DC Rainmaker, after all.

LOL
The e-Bike Connect is automatic with the new e-bikes. When you power the bike up to ride, the connect automatically runs. I was playing with Strava and Apple Health to see how each of them interacts with things ilke my fitness program app and other things like that. I had no idea Trailforks was recording anything, just used it for maps on the ride, and later got an email asking if I wanted to sync my ride with a login on Pinkbike via Strava.

I do get a screen on my bike when I stop too long that asks if I want to restart the ride.

 

[wooglin]

Strava on a smart phone is close enough for me.

 

[Doug Briggs]

I'm mostly recording rides for the sake of keeping track of days out and hours ridden (for maintenance). Accuracy of speed isn't that big a deal although I do like to see how long and how much elevation new rides have so I can better judge future rides for difficulty and duration.

I've slowed down a lot in the last year or two for the sake of self-preservation. PRs and the like don't mean much to me.

I use Strava and my Moto Z2. Usually it works great. Some days, but not often, it is a mess. And it seems to coincide with other's having data infelicities. Weird.

 

[princo]

I record the rides in my GPS unit. Then I upload them to Strava and use the "Correct Distance" and "Correct Elevation" features under the ride's summary. Whichever shows higher totals stays.

 

[Ski&ride]

At one time, my handle bar were a crowded place: computer, GPS, lights all fighting for their spot!

First, I took the computer off, the GPS kind of make that redundant. But then, decided I don’t really need the GPS after all. I know where I’m going. I know how fast I’m going. The GPS may confirm that to within .5 mph accuracy but no better. Instead, a bell was added! (far more useful for maintaining social distance in crowded post-COVID trials)

 

[EricG]

Garmin Edge 530: auto pause on (not sure the speed), recording interval set to 1 second, GPS+GLONASS enabled. No other devices, Ie speed sensors, watch or phone (No cell reception anyways). My times were very similar to others using similar devices.

 

[firebanex]

Just looked at my evening ride today. Recorded it on both a Wahoo Bolt w/ wheel sensor and my Garmin Forerunner 945 watch. Bolt recorded 27.19 miles and my watch recorded 27.13 miles, I've never really seen the degree of inconsistency that you are showing. Even the elevation recorded was within 1ft of each device.

 

[Lauren]

I've been tracking with my Garmin Fenix 6S watch. I have only used it with auto-pause off, and GPS+GLONASS.

Whenever I upload an activity is uploaded to Strava, it always adds a little bit to my ride (normally approx. 1/2 mile). I looked this up on Garmin's FAQ/forums and it seems to be a pretty normal occurrence for people. The answer was that Strava takes Garmin's waypoints, and calculates it's own distance...which is slightly different calculations that Garmin's. So my guess is that TrailForks does the same, and has it's own calculations too.

I used to record using my phone (which was always in my pack), and would consistently record significantly less mileage than the people I was with...now with the watch, I'm much closer.

 

[oldschoolskier]

I use an app called ride tracker, works well.

As to your and Phil’s time difference, he forgot to end his ride.

 

[Tony S]

Phil and I were on the exact same ride. He was having to stop and wait for me regularly, so I'm baffled why his time was so different than mine.

On top of Rudi's comment about auto-pause, which sure sounds right, I just wanted to add this:

Don't start looking closely at individual Strava segments on the leader board or you will REALLY be scratching your head! Lots of possible explanations for "unexpected results," but IME the most common explanation for slower time for a faster rider is that the faster rider spent some or all of her "waiting" time while actually still inside the segment. For this reason, when CREATING segments, it's good to start them slightly after the "start" intersection or whatever it is. And to end them slightly before the natural ending landmark. Almost no one seems to have the patience our presence of mind to do this.

 

[Tony S]

data infelicities

I love this.

 

[Tony S]

All of which is why I sometimes find myself saying politely to @Wending, "please put that phone away and ride."

 

[Doug Briggs]

I love this.

Data infelicities goes hand in hand with 'It's not a bug, it's an undocumented feature.'

 

[cantunamunch]

So here's a bit of data from an experiment for you. Fixed gear bike. Cadence between 85 and 93. Flat trail with a total rise of 90 feet over 22 miles. No crosswinds, no traffic. There is one actual full stop at the 11 mile mark -all the other variations are tree and roadcut (as in big granite walls either side) error. It didn't even register the turnaround (at mile 22) as a full stop.

In case you're wondering, this was on an Edge 520 just like Rudi's above.

 

[scott43]

Yeah I'm not surprised. It ain't perfect that's for sure.

 

[cantunamunch]

Yeah I'm not surprised. It ain't perfect that's for sure.

Yeah. I was running 42x17 with a 27" wheel so there is something weird going on with the overall averaging too - I'm going to have to re-check thresholds.

 

[KevinF]

I did a ride with @Needham earlier this year; my Garmin recorded ~4200 vertical feet while his phone / Strava app recorded about ~4600 over the same ride.

Obviously we determined that his phone was the more accurate one.

I do mostly loop rides from my residence; I routinely see that the starting and ending elevations are not the same -- i.e., they can easily be off by several dozen feet. I figure the elevation tracking is at best reasonably accurate.

 

[Beartown]

Strava (at least using iphone) records ”moving time” (which is listed as ”time” on the main record of the ride) and “elapsed time” (which includes time stopped). you can see these on the analysis section. It’d be informative to compare your elapsed times for those rides.
here’s a rides where I was waiting for a buddy several times: