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Doug Briggs

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Use two shims. One under the toe and one under the heel. You want to raise the entire boot. The heel usually presents some problems because of the ski brake.

The shims @rcc55125 is mentioning are typically done under the binding, or on the boot directly. Experimenting with height is going to be a challenge using just temporary shims between the boot and binding.

Note that in our shop, we don't compensate for leg length differences by adding the total difference to one boot/ski. Typically we'll adjust by about 50% of the difference. As I'm not a boot fitter, I don't know the exact reasoning for this. I do install the shims under the bindings as a shop ski tech.
 

Average Joe

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As someone with a 15mm leg length differential i can attest there are vast improvement opportunities from corrective boot work.
The device that was used on me was a big caliper with a bubble level that located the hip bones.
 

Doug Briggs

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As someone with a 15mm leg length differential i can attest there are vast improvement opportunities from corrective boot work.
The device that was used on me was a big caliper with a bubble level that located the hip bones.

Out of curiosity, did they add 15mm to one boot/binding lift or just part of 15mm?
 
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Wendy

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As someone with a 15mm leg length differential i can attest there are vast improvement opportunities from corrective boot work.
The device that was used on me was a big caliper with a bubble level that located the hip bones.

That’s a huge difference. I’d love to see a pic of that caliper.
 

Average Joe

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No the boot lug won't allow a 15 mm nor would you want to do that amount of correction.
My street shoe orthotics have a 10mm correction and my ski boots have, I think, a 5mm external correction and a few mm under the footbed.
As far as the effectiveness - I suffered lower back pain for 20plus years (mid 20's to late 40's), chiropractic visits, physical therapy, etc., now pain free for 10 years since correction.
Skiing, less dramatic, however I noticed an immediate improvement in transition and balance on both skis after correction. I think we may compensate on both turns when one is "out of whack"- as if the bad alignment turn also affects the "good" side, because we can't process the "good/bad/good/bad" sequence......
 

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@Wendy one other thing comes to mind, you’re stance may be too wide (which seems to happen to a lot of newer skiers).

It starts wide in straight running as you go into turns it may be widening even more causing you to A frame.

The second thought is in turns do both skis show that they are on edge or is one ski running flatter (usually inside ski). This is a poor technique/balancing issue.
 
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Wendy

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@Wendy one other thing comes to mind, you’re stance may be too wide (which seems to happen to a lot of newer skiers).

It starts wide in straight running as you go into turns it may be widening even more causing you to A frame.

The second thought is in turns do both skis show that they are on edge or is one ski running flatter (usually inside ski). This is a poor technique/balancing issue.

My stance is OK. Ive been told at times to widen it, not narrow it.

I can’t comment on edge matching of my skis, until I get video or photos next season. So I do realize that people’s ability to provide guidance is limited at this point.
 
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Wendy

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Good points! Thanks, Jamt!

I do know that my left arch is partially collapsed.
A bunion forming on that foot is probably a symptom.
My ski boot footbeds do correct for that arch.
I do walk barefoot as much as possible, and I will pay attention to my stance more.
I do a lot of squats and lateral exercises in my boxing class; I will pay attention there, as well as when I’m on my stand up paddle board.
I used to box in bare feet, but the mats are kind of gross. :(
I never wear heels.

All that said, I do think the root of the problem lies here somewhere.
 

oldschoolskier

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My stance is OK. Ive been told at times to widen it, not narrow it.

I can’t comment on edge matching of my skis, until Imget video or photos next season. So I do realize that people’s ability to provide guidance is limited at this point.
The “Ok stance, and widen it” is why beginner (and intermediate) skiers have this issue. At the lower levels they force balance and most instructors at the lower level don’t yet understand the impact of a too wide stance.

I’m more old school, narrow is good as long as you are balanced and are not impeded in motion by too narrow of a stance. Width is driven by balance requirements.

Women tend to start with a wider stance, body structure so going wide is not always best.

Seversl years back I taught at a local hill, and a CSIA 2 and 3 commented that I was way to narrow, my reply was, follow me do at speed (picked it up to race pace) and tell me again. 1. They couldn’t keep up, 2. They comment was that was great. Point is my separation (width) didn’t really change, just my angulation and vertical separation did. See @razie avatar, he actually has a very narrow stance and huge vertical separation.

Stance width and vertical separation are vastly different, in your first photo the skier on the left has too much width for the vertical separation hence an “A” frame. The skier on the right has almost no vertical with huge width (this is why there is no “A” frame). This is a very common error and easy error to fall into.

Top racers have very narrow stances in high speed huge angle turns, but huge vertical separation, looks like a wide stance but it’s not, which is why there is no “A” frame.

Hopefully this makes sense.
 

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Yes, shims and footbeds will help with lateral alignment while skiing, but they do not adresss the underlying issue which is an underperforming left foot and posterior chain (like your glutes). Off season work on intrinsic foot strength in coordination with glute activation and pelvic mobility will take you a long ways towards your goal!

Right now it sounds like you are trying to roll your knee out, but on the wrong (medial) side of your left foot. Not gonna happen. This is what I was getting at with my previous post :)

zenny
 

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Also wondering if you have an history in regards to injury to either your left foot, right foot, or both. Injuries can cause the body weight to unconciously he ‘shifted away’ from a foot. Another major cause of a ‘collapsed arch’ is spending a lot of time sitting like at work (hip flexion) which kills the glutes, or wearing overly supportive shoes with inserts which shuts off arch activation...body says ‘I don’t need to form an arch because it’s already supported from underneath’, hence a weak foot. Also could be a combo of all of the above...

One solution for a collapsed arch can actually be to encourage that foot to pronate even more because the muscles that decelerate the motion of a pronating foot are already locked long and aren’t capable of returning the leg the other way. So finding a way (carefully!) of encouraging further lengthening can help ‘wake them up’.

Use at your own discretion and under the guidance of a PT!

zenny
 
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Wendy

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Also wondering if you have an history in regards to injury to either your left foot, right foot, or both. Injuries can cause the body weight to unconciously he ‘shifted away’ from a foot. Another major cause of a ‘collapsed arch’ is spending a lot of time sitting like at work (hip flexion) which kills the glutes, or wearing overly supportive shoes with inserts which shuts off arch activation...body says ‘I don’t need to form an arch because it’s already supported from underneath’, hence a weak foot. Also could be a combo of all of the above...

One solution for a collapsed arch can actually be to encourage that foot to pronate even more because the muscles that decelerate the motion of a pronating foot are already locked long and aren’t capable of returning the leg the other way. So finding a way (carefully!) of encouraging further lengthening can help ‘wake them up’.

Use at your own discretion and under the guidance of a PT!

zenny

No injury to any feet.
I did have a meniscus tear and subsequent repair, about 10 years ago. However, that injury was most likely a symptom of, not a cause of, some imbalance.

I am a teacher, so I am on my feet a lot. At home, I’m on my feet a lot, too.
 

Zentune

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No injury to any feet.
I did have a meniscus tear and subsequent repair, about 10 years ago. However, that injury was most likely a symptom of, not a cause of, some imbalance.

I am a teacher, so I am on my feet a lot. At home, I’m on my feet a lot, too.

What kind of shoes do you typically wear? Also, do you spend any time barefoot at home? Also, that meniscal tear will certainly have an impact on knee rotation during flexing/extending pronating/supinating so keep that in mind, the body typically shies away from an injury, even if it’s been repaired.

zenny
 
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Wendy

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What kind of shoes do you typically wear? Also, do you spend any time barefoot at home?

zenny

I’m nearly always barefoot at home.
I wear Chacos, Altra (zero drop) running shoes, never any heels. The shoes with the greatest drop I wear are Danskos.
I hate “dress” shoes.
 

Zentune

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Good! I edited my comment above in regards to your meniscus btw. Sounds like you are on the right path , keep working! :)

zenny
 

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Wendy, your post made me think of another Wendy who might make you feel better about A-framing. Here's Wendy Fisher:



When I posted those videos before somebody inevitably mentioned her A-frame without comment on how it was hurting her skiing. I can't recall who it was, but I'm rather certain they couldn't keep up with her. :D

The great discussion above raises the question if the whole A-frame thing is fashion or function?
 

Doug Briggs

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...

When I posted those videos before somebody inevitably mentioned her A-frame without comment on how it was hurting her skiing. I can't recall who it was, but I'm rather certain they couldn't keep up with her. :D

The great discussion above raises the question if the whole A-frame thing is fashion or function?

Good question. In a word the answer is both.

WCers a-frame quite often. Does it keep them from winning? Sometimes yes, sometimes no. It is knowing when an a-frame isn't a problem and avoiding it when it is a problem that separates the winners from the losers. The WCers don't care how they look, per se, they care about their time. Sometimes looking 'good' can be slow. Sometimes it can be fast.

Wendy Fischer's a-framing doesn't prevent her from making the kind of turns she apparently is happy with on the terrain she is skiing in the videos. @Wendy is looking to improve her racing skills where her a-frame may or may not be interfering with her desired goals. If her a-frame is blocking her from balancing on the inside edge of the outside ski, it is a problem. If not, then not. We don't know with certainty because we only have @Wendy 's words describing her goals and her perceptions.

Most of the comments in this thread are quite valid yet we don't really know if they all apply to @Wendy . Until we have images and/or video, we can only speculate. To the question @tball poses, for @Wendy , it is probably a functional issue that needs to be addressed to permit her achieve better edge angles and faster times. For those that ski for the joy of it it may be either form or function or even both. I can tell you that I've seen plenty of people skiing with a-frames that can kick ass and plenty skiing with 'perfect' style that look stilted.
 
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Wendy

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Wendy, your post made me think of another Wendy who might make you feel better about A-framing. Here's Wendy Fisher:



When I posted those videos before somebody inevitably mentioned her A-frame without comment on how it was hurting her skiing. I can't recall who it was, but I'm rather certain they couldn't keep up with her. :D

The great discussion above raises the question if the whole A-frame thing is fashion or function?

THANK YOU for this! ogsmile

I have had the “fashion or function” discussion with my bootfitter. He has implored me to just go ski. I ski off piste, trees, bumps, whatever (not like Wendy Fisher, though, lol). My A frame has not prevented me from doing those things. I can carve, smear, and pivot. But, I can be a whole lot better..so is the A frame preventing improvement?

That said, it is a fact that I have a pretty large strength discrepancy between right and left legs. And an arch issue. And a surgical knee. I will do everything I can to correct the strength issue (without driving myself bonkers) but it may not correct the A frame, even if I get to being able to ski on just my left foot.

As a former competitive cyclist, I am used to focusing on my body movements and positions. And that has caused me to not like how I look skiiing with my A frame. I am hard on myself.

A closer look at my edge angles next year will give me more info. A talk with my race clinic coach will be helpful, too. I will post video and pics next season for more feedback.

But....I ski for fun, for stress release, for camaraderie. I need to be careful not to spoil all that by being overly focused on a problem that may not actually be a huge “problem.”
 
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Wendy

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Good question. In a word the answer is both.

WCers a-frame quite often. Does it keep them from winning? Sometimes yes, sometimes no. It is knowing when an a-frame isn't a problem and avoiding it when it is a problem that separates the winners from the losers. The WCers don't care how they look, per se, they care about their time. Sometimes looking 'good' can be slow. Sometimes it can be fast.

Wendy Fischer's a-framing doesn't prevent her from making the kind of turns she apparently is happy with on the terrain she is skiing in the videos. @Wendy is looking to improve her racing skills where her a-frame may or may not be interfering with her desired goals. If her a-frame is blocking her from balancing on the inside edge of the outside ski, it is a problem. If not, then not. We don't know with certainty because we only have @Wendy 's words describing her goals and her perceptions.

Most of the comments in this thread are quite valid yet we don't really know if they all apply to @Wendy . Until we have images and/or video, we can only speculate. To the question @tball poses, for @Wendy , it is probably a functional issue that needs to be addressed to permit her achieve better edge angles and faster times. For those that ski for the joy of it it may be either form or function or even both. I can tell you that I've seen plenty of people skiing with a-frames that can kick ass and plenty skiing with 'perfect' style that look stilted.

Thank you!

I agree.....it’s hard without video or pics. I’m digging round for some, but I will post some next season for feedback.
 

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