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- Oct 4, 2017
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Wow I did not realize Challenger had that much vertical wow. Are all the runs down from there moguled or are their any bowls/steep groomers?
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First week of April?
- Thread starter Slim
- Start date
Wow I did not realize Challenger had that much vertical wow. Are all the runs down from there moguled or are their any bowls/steep groomers?
Thread Starter
TS
Unless you have very few skiers, a bowl without fresh snow is just another word for moguls ;-)
https://www.haganskimountaineering.com/collections/junior-collection
So, just use alpine boots. My kids did that last year, but with adult frame bindings
oh, and, low fares on Norwegian Air?
http://www.travelandleisure.com/flight-deals/cheap-flights-norwegian-air-bergen-summer
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Correct about Kicking Horse. The only way to stay on top is to take the Stairway to Heavan lift and ski the Crystal Bowl. This is not the most interesting part of the mountain, so realistically, most laps will bring you to the base.
Generally speaking, snow can be pretty reasonable, until the catamount chair top at 1600m. Then it's just a zip down a groomer to the gondola. The steep chutes are all above 2100m.
Fernie has two lifts that start significantly higher than the 1070 m base.
White Pass Starts at 1550m and the Polar Peak Starts at 1870. Both can be lapped, but probably not all day.
To retrun to the White Pass base you must ski the Timber Bowl, and you miss out on the long, fun runs in Currie. The Polar Peak chair doesn't have a tonne of vert, and some runs connect best with the base. The Boomerang and Bear Chairs don't hit the base, but are both pretty low. The top of the Bear Chair (highest point on the old side) is not much higher than the top of the Catamount chair at Kicking Horse.
For comparison, Sunshine's Village is at 2200 meters and if you are lapping Paradise and Summit at Louise, you will stay above 2190 meters.
Flights to Bodo, Norway are not $89. But, it's also not an ordinary journey, nor destination.
https://www.switchbacktravel.com/norway/getting-to-lofoten
If only my kids had school break in April, and were young enough to take out of school an extra week.
https://www.switchbacktravel.com/norway/getting-to-lofoten
If only my kids had school break in April, and were young enough to take out of school an extra week.
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No groomers off of Challenger or the Tram. Steeps yes, moguls yes, pucker factor yes & with fresh snow or wind buff freshies. If you didn't find enough a short hike up the ridge you will find more either dropping towards the tram or the Moonlight side. Even the "easy" run off of Challenger Moonlight can be taken down Bad Dog to give 2100+ feet of bumps to the Iron Horse lift.
One last point regarding Fernie.
I am not a local, but I like to ski there. My comments are based on experience with a small April sample, and impressions I get when following snowfall in the Calgary region.
You can get a better perspective from Bill Handley, who has skied Fernie nearly every day since 2009, and written a detailed trip report for each day out. Pick the dates you want from the archive secion on the right.
http://www.billhandley.com/
Before Bill started his blog, Craig Morris did his own independent trip reports. Archives from his legendary site are still available to view.
http://s3.amazonaws.com/redtree/far/reports.html
So you have trip reports from the last 22 years of April skiing in Fernie
I am not a local, but I like to ski there. My comments are based on experience with a small April sample, and impressions I get when following snowfall in the Calgary region.
You can get a better perspective from Bill Handley, who has skied Fernie nearly every day since 2009, and written a detailed trip report for each day out. Pick the dates you want from the archive secion on the right.
http://www.billhandley.com/
Before Bill started his blog, Craig Morris did his own independent trip reports. Archives from his legendary site are still available to view.
http://s3.amazonaws.com/redtree/far/reports.html
So you have trip reports from the last 22 years of April skiing in Fernie
- Joined
- Oct 4, 2017
- Posts
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2100' vert of bumps is like my nightmare.
Unless they are smaller soft bumps. Then it's like heaven.
A thaw and refreeze cycle or sun scorch can change the slopes, but Big Sky is typically soft bumps and the shadow of Challenger Ridge keeps the northerly aspects from sun scorch.
Note that TonyC is unable to respond. At least one of your options, Taos, usually closes around the first of April unless having a banner year and they extend for a week or weekend, so make sure you check closing dates before making plans. Sometimes the best way to do this is by checking their events page and if you see no more events or see pond skimming, they are probably closing.
I was at Fernie, BC and Castle Mountain, AB last Thurs-Sun and highly recommend both places, especially Castle. Castle does not require new snow as wind can improve skiing there and they have some of the longest steep runs I have skied. See some of the windsift skiing pictures I posted in the Northern Rockies/Alberta thread.
TonyC also sent me the following to try to help you out:
"I have a feature article from 2001 still applicable with regard to family ski vacations at Christmas and Spring Break: http://bestsnow.net/fam_ski.htm
As for this year:
Don't even think about Crested Butte and Taos, which take a long time to open their steeps even in normal years. Taos is currently 45% open, up from 25% two weeks ago when they had received less than 3 feet of natural snow the entire season. There have been two feet since then, but far more is needed. It's the end of February and there is still zero terrain open on Crested Butte's North Face. If any gets open, it's going to be limited and bony, barring miracle dumps which rarely happen in Colorado. The usual consistent small storms we have seen in February won't make up that kind of deficit in only one more month.
Copper and Winter Park: Copper is among the elite in snow preservation and Winter Park is pretty good too. Both are 90+% open now and very unlikely to lose terrain by April 1 even if March is relatively dry.
Fernie/Kicking Horse, B.C. : They are having a banner season, but of course surface conditions are driven by altitude/exposure even when the base is deep. Mike Rogers has it right that Kicking Horse has quite good snow preservation while Fernie is more of a crapshoot due to relatively low altitude. Fernie is mostly east facing ridgelines, all of which have north side trees with decent snow preservation and you can try to time the sunnier exposures. Even though Copper/Winter Park is the safer bet for snow conditions, Slim's more advanced/expert skier profile really points to Fernie/Kicking Horse as the right call for 2017-18. And don't forget to throw in a day or two at Castle Mt. between Fernie and Calgary, which is higher and colder than Fernie. Last weekend at Castle Saturday and Fernie Sunday were epic.
Brighton/Solitude/Deer Valley/Powder Mt. : Deer Valley and Powder Mt. are low altitude for Utah with primary east exposure at DV and varied at Powder Mt. Powder Mt. was less than half open until a week ago, which does not bode well for a good late season in any warm weather. Brighton and Solitude are good for snow preservation, but not as good as Alta/Snowbird. For expert skiers going to Utah in April, not doing Alta/Snowbird doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.
Big Sky/Grand Targhee: Yes Targhee is primarily west facing with the longest fall lines somewhat SW. Often the chronic cloud keeps the sun off that snow, but in April it might not take more than an hour or two to start a melt/freeze. Big Sky is better. The Moonlight Basin side (30% of terrain ) faces north and should retain winter snow. The upper Lone Peak runs face south, but at 10,000 feet I had great skiing in late March on my first trip there. While Big Sky is OK in spring, it's definitely not as good as the Colorado places or Bachelor and probably not as good as Kicking Horse or Brighton/Solitude.
Mt. Bachelor: This is the capital of lift served corn in North America and April is prime season for it following the sun around off the 360 degree summit. While Bachelor had a rough early season, it has received 5 feet of snow in the past two weeks and has a 95-inch base, so I wouldn't worry about adequate snow this April. Bachelor is primarily intermediate pitch, not much real steep, but if you get a good corn cycle it's quite impressive even for stronger skiers.
My conclusion is that in 2017-18 you should take advantage of western Canada's great season. The resorts on your pass, Kicking Horse and Fernie, also have the advantage of being a good fit for Slim's expert skier profile."
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I watched a bunch of youtube video's of the run off of Challenger last night and they definitely look fun and right in my range as far as the amount of challenge they offer. In almost all the videos I watched (from various years) the bumps looked soft and well spaced which is how I like them. Some of the runs look like a good test to see if I would want to try something like liberty bowl as well.
The best analog of the Liberty Bowl off of Challenger is Highway as the angle and the sun exposure are similar. If Highway is crusty from the sun you can easily traverse into BRT, St Alphonse trees or 17 Green for fluffier snow. Once you are in Liberty you are committed unless you traverse skiers right into even steeper terrain. Skiing off of the tram is fun in good conditions but there is usually a 30 to 40 minute line
Thread Starter
TS
Thanks so much Tony & Tony!
I have read TonyC’s spring skiing articles.(Several times in fact) as well as every other one I could find. The one question I had is that they focus on late April, even May, so I wondered how relevant that was for the first week of April.
The info from the two of you should really help me and others who have an Easter break this year out a lot!
One thing I wonder is if my skill/desire level hasn’t gotten a bit overstated. I am more on the advanced than the expert side. In most resorts I enjoy skiing the black runs, the trees and the bowls, but the double black stuff is usually on the upper end of my skill level, and I don’t search for it for sustained pitches. I never ski true chutes, between rock walls with sustained super steep pitches. I never do mandatory air.
I also ski with my 7 and 10 year old girls, who are skilled skiers, but not experts.
Last week at Copper we happily skied the top of the mountain, including some double black stuff, but it was all with only fairly short pitches of steeps.
From my friend’s description of Kicking Horse:
"first day at Kicking Horse, most of the black doings here would be double blacks in most of the US resorts”
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I think you will be fine, Slim.
I don't know Copper, so I can't compare. Have you skied Whistler, Snowbird, Alta, or Jackson?
I don't know Copper, so I can't compare. Have you skied Whistler, Snowbird, Alta, or Jackson?
Thread Starter
TS
No, none of those. I just know that in the resorts I have skied (Brighton, Deer Valley, Copper, Winter park, Steamboat) I tend to ski skip the easiest runs and the hardest lines, and ski mostly in the middle difficulty: blue black, and single black, with only the occianal short steep pitch giving a double black rating. Like I said, I don’t ski true chutes or runs with mandatory air.
My friend, who made the comment above, skis with me and is a better skier than me (he has mostly been skiing Big Sky).
I am not worried that there is nothing I could ski at Kicking Horse, but more puzzled by the fact that @TonyC wrote that he wouldn’t consider skipping Alta/Snowbird for an advanced skier and that for an expert skier Kicking Horse would be more fun than Colorado.
So, my question was, since I don’t feel like I was ‘outsking’ Copper or Brighton, maybe his recommendations were aimed at a more skilled skier than I am.
But maybe it means that there is more of the moderately pitched, remote feeling, ungroomed, terrain I love.
Slim, where did you decide to take your family next week? We’re headed to Sunshine and KH.
Sunshine & KH should be great next week! BS has received ~20 inches this week at the base of the mountain with more on the way.
Thanks for the stoke! I'm brain cramping and I'm sure it will be obvious when you tell me, but what is "BS"?
BS can mean a lot of things, but in this case Big Sky, Montana the resort in the town with the same name that straddles Madison and Gallatin counties.
Thread Starter
TS
Sorry for the late reply:
We ended up going to Big Cottonwood canyon, with a few non-skiing days in Park City. Coverage was near 100%, but conditions were were very variable, warm, rain, fresh snow, graupel and a deep freeze.