European vs American style skiing

[onstar1]

How popular is off-piste or powder skiing in Europe? It seem to be more popular in the US. I see Europe as mostly groomers and and skinny carving skies.

 

[Primoz]

Getting more and more popular, and as everything also this is coming over here... including idea wide skis are great for icy groomers But things are different, from weather to how resorts operate (mainly avi mitigation and safety of off piste skiing).

 

[Swede]

Off piste generally a bit more niche-activity over here that in the US or Canada. Average skiers tend (in the alps) to stay on piste as most off piste terrain is out of bounds=dangerous. But it's catching on. Scandinavia a bit more "Americanised" than the alpes inme when it comes to equipment. And the "mountains" in Norway/Sweden aren't as dangerous when it comes to off piste. When you see someone on "phat" skis skiing groomers in the alpes, quite often they are Swedes or Norwegians inme.

 

[Goose]

Are not the alps generally steeper than the rockies? As swede mentioned more of the off piste may be too steep. If I recall correctly from my trip to Austria (including some swiss skiing too) back in the 80's it seemed a lot of the piste runs were surrounded by cliffs and generally steep terrain often roped off due to its near vertical drops.

Also it snows more in the rockies and is of the dryer fluffier snow (the famous powder) is not quite the same. So you got more snow, fluffier snow, and more places that don't fall as steeply. Unless im wrong about all that,....it makes for better (more practical) opportunities which allow for more off piste skiing.

 

[newfydog]

In the 1960's my parents told me how much of the skiing in Europe is above tree line, and wind packed, so they don't need to groom- you can ski evertywhere.. I first skied the Lauberhorn in 1972, there was no grooming, and people skied everywhere. I returned 30 years later, they had groomed one swath, and that was all anyone skied.

 

[Crank]

Just got back from a week in Val d'Isere & Tignes. We did some guided off piste and then some off piste on our own. There is definitely more of an off piste, make all the fresh tracks you can culture here in the states. That said, the more obvious and relatively avalanche safe runs were getting tracked up...it just took longer than it would at most stateside resorts.

 

[Mike King]

This film is pretty intense. It highlights that members of the US Ski Team did not understand the difference between groomers and off-piste in Europe.

 

[speedster]

This film is pretty intense. It highlights that members of the US Ski Team did not understand the difference between groomers and off-piste in Europe.

Wow that is quite an intense film.

 

[wallyk]

agreed with @speedster ..... that was intense.......not what I was expecting......well done.

 

[Ski&ride]

Wow!

That erases any doubt on what’s the biggest difference between skiing in Europe vs United States!

 

[fatbob]

I thought the incident was kinda shocking at the time but had put it mentally down to young hotshots pushing the boundaries and "breaking da rulz". The reality seems to be even more shocking - surely USST is partly culpable for sending kids off to Europe without a solid orientation as to safety?

Is this education programme part of a settlement with the families?

 

[Swede]

Outside a marked piste in the alpes — you’re on your own. No avy control, no insurance... When on glaciere terrain, cravasses. It can be seriously dangerous if you do not have the right training and local knowledge. I have done my fare share of really stupid things. Blame it on youth. I wouldn’t venture out in terrain w/o a local. I have kids.

 

[AlpsSkidad]

I have noticed that many of the multi day kids group classes in Austria include classroom sessions on avalanche safety. Even for 4/5/6 year olds.

 

[Swede]

This film is pretty intense. It highlights that members of the US Ski Team did not understand the difference between groomers and off-piste in Europe.

Strong film about a very sad accident. All I can say is watch it!

 

[Nathanvg]

Good video overall. My only complaint is they emphasize gear without calling out its limits. 54% of people with a beacon die when cought in an avalanche. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15772502 beacons help, but the focus has to be on avoiding the avalanche in the first place.

It isn't clear in the video if the ski team didn't understand off piste was uncontrolled terrain or if they didn't understand the risks of uncontrolled terrain. Either way, I'll be messaging both to kids in my life.

 

[Mike Rogers]

Good video overall. My only complaint is they emphasize gear without calling out its limits. 54% of people with a beacon die when cought in an avalanche. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15772502 beacons help, but the focus has to be on avoiding the avalanche in the first place.

It isn't clear in the video if the ski team didn't understand off piste was uncontrolled terrain or if they didn't understand the risks of uncontrolled terrain. Either way, I'll be messaging both to kids in my life.

It's particularly bad in areas know for tree skiing. Traumatic injuries from avalanches kill. It's also important to remember that people who successfully deploy an airbag (not necessarily an easy thing to do) can be buried. Flotation is less useful in terrain traps.

 

[James]

It isn't clear in the video if the ski team didn't understand off piste was uncontrolled terrain or if they didn't understand the risks of uncontrolled terrain. Either way, I'll be messaging both to kids in my life.

My take away is they didn't understand that within the "ski area" you could cause a catastrophic avalanche. Right near a groomer. That is extremely rare in the US. They basically treated it as if they were at say Snowbird/Jackson Hole. If not roped off and in bounds, it's ok.

 

[Seldomski]

This happened last week in St. Anton:

https://www.reuters.com/video/2019/03/19/skiers-caught-in-avalanche?videoId=527913822

Just because there are a bunch of people on it, you can access it easily from lifts, and you can see lifts from the slope doesn't mean it's safe. Very different from North American resorts. If a run is not marked, that means it's (likely) not patrolled/controlled, etc.

 

[James]

This happened last week in St. Anton:

https://www.reuters.com/video/2019/03/19/skiers-caught-in-avalanche?videoId=527913822

Just because there are a bunch of people on it, you can access it easily from lifts, and you can see lifts from the slope doesn't mean it's safe. Very different from North American resorts. If a run is not marked, that means it's (likely) not patrolled/controlled, etc.

That was posted in the Avy thread. What a cluster. Like 4 people that you can see start at once. Nearly in the same spot. Even on a groomer that would be bad.

 

[dbostedo]

It isn't clear in the video if the ski team didn't understand off piste was uncontrolled terrain or if they didn't understand the risks of uncontrolled terrain. Either way, I'll be messaging both to kids in my life.

I thought that from some of the statements made from the others, it was pretty clear they didn't realize it was uncontrolled. One of the guys said something like "the concept of riding up a lift, skiing on a trail, and we're in danger? That didn't exist in any of our heads". Then one of their fathers says that "None of the boys knew the difference between on and off-piste" and elaborates on that a bit.