Drill Engage, Redirect, Release, repeat...

[bud heishman]

Reading the thread on inclination, I started thinking about the sensations I am feeling through a turn. "Engage" my edges after I have released my Com to move across my skis to the inside of the new turn, "Redirect" involves building forces to redirect the path of my CoM and "Release" occurs when I let go of the old turn allowing my inertia and CoM to move across my feet to change edges then reengage on the new edges.

Of course thinking about the release there seems to be two releases, one with my CoM and one with my edges. It would seem a less skilled skier (ie Level I instructor) will not be able to effectively coordinate these two releases and consequently take longer to transition from turn to turn. An expert skier can begin to release his/her CoM toward the new turn while simultaneously keeping the edges engaged and turning a bit longer before releasing them into the new turn. This is where angulating becomes a finely tuned skill, being able to keep the skis engaged with the lower legs while permitting the upper body to begin moving toward the inside of the new turn. Looking at the photomontage of Razie in the Inclination thread demonstrates this skill.

What do you think?

 

[Tricia]

I think where most people get hung up is, they hold on. You can't engage a new edge if you don't release.

 

[Chris Geib]

As a gross generalization I could likely agree, Tricia.


I like your description, Bud. I think it is more then skill level though …and I know you agree! ( I haven't seen the other thread)

As I have said many times before, the majority of skiers spend/expend their effort regulating their speed down the slope; In the Good skier (as I expect you and I recognize similarly) not only is there a higher level of proficiency but also the offensive mindset managing their line such that speed control is largely a by-product of the line choice.

So on a skill basis a different “expert” would be extremely good at managing their speed, but that is not the “expert” I believe you are describing.

However, I know you to foster an offensive mindset in those you teach and can develop the new skier to manage their line and movement across the skis as you describe above at the very lowest level of proficiency.

So the new skier you coach can do it, they just likely cannot do it as well. They may execute flow across the skis better then the 30 year veteran that is an expert at check turns who cannot move across the skis and instead must move/displace their feet.

Well, I think I’ll go for a hike…

 

[tromano]

Moving the feet and com separately and in coordination and the timing of that was something I was able to figure out last season. Definitely helped me improve my bump skiing quite a bit having my com setup so that once my feet released I could start turning in balance and not wait until my com caught up which in the past would leave me forever behind the power curve.

It's also fun to play around with moving my com in different directions at different times.

 

[SBrown]

As a gross generalization I could likely agree, Tricia.


I like your description, Bud. I think it is more then skill level though …and I know you agree! ( I haven't seen the other thread)

As I have said many times before, the majority of skiers spend/expend their effort regulating their speed down the slope; In the Good skier (as I expect you and I recognize similarly) not only is there a higher level of proficiency but also the offensive mindset managing their line such that speed control is largely a by-product of the line choice.

So on a skill basis a different “expert” would be extremely good at managing their speed, but that is not the “expert” I believe you are describing.

However, I know you to foster an offensive mindset in those you teach and can develop the new skier to manage their line and movement across the skis as you describe above at the very lowest level of proficiency.

So the new skier you coach can do it, they just likely cannot do it as well. They may execute flow across the skis better then the 30 year veteran that is an expert at check turns who cannot move across the skis and instead must move/displace their feet.

Well, I think I’ll go for a hike…

That's one way to displace your feet ...

 

[Tricia]

@Chris Geib nice of you to "likely" agree with me. I'm not nearly as articulate as you are when posting about these things.

 

[Philpug]

Of course thinking about the release there seems to be two releases, one with my CoM and one with my edges. It would seem a less skilled skier (ie Level I instructor) will not be able to effectively coordinate these two releases and consequently take longer to transition from turn to turn. An expert skier can begin to release his/her CoM toward the new turn while simultaneously keeping the edges engaged and turning a bit longer before releasing them into the new turn. This is where angulating becomes a finely tuned skill, being able to keep the skis engaged with the lower legs while permitting the upper body to begin moving toward the inside of the new turn. Looking at the photomontage of Razie in the Inclination thread demonstrates this skill.

What do you think?

Yes, there are two things here that do need to be separated, changing the direction of the mass, the body and the edges of the skis. you bring up the point that they are different which can/should be an AH-HA! moment for many skiers at this transition level. They are so addement to release the body that they release everything and not complete the turm because they are so anxious to get to the next turn. By doing this, they are completeing the turn that they are in. If they hold the edge it will automatically ccome around into the next turn naturally.

 

[Chris Geib]

@Chris Geib nice of you to "likely" agree with me. I'm not nearly as articulate as you are when posting about these things.

Eh, sorry I just make things too complicated I guess!

 

[Tricia]

I didn't say complicated. In fact, you've made some things extremely clear to me.
How was that hike?

 

[Chris Geib]

Hike was good! Bit over 8 miles Lori's tracker says, so some base miles in prep for our tour around Mont Blanc coming up.

Thinks I need to do a bit of boot work though, feet are good but not delighted just yet

 

[Philpug]

Hike was good! Bit over 8 miles Lori's tracker says, so some base miles in prep for our tour around Mont Blanc coming up.

Thinks I need to do a bit of boot work though, feet are good but not delighted just yet

Time to fire the Foredom up.

 

[Chris Geib]

It is in place and ready to go if needed!

This one is looking like a job for the belt ...so far anyway

 

[bud heishman]

Did you ever get Lori's feet sorted out, er her boots?


Chris I "likely" agree with your post above! Of course the skier's intent to turn is another huge key contributing to the big picture and the "infinity" move! Just trying to focus on the sensations to create a simple mantra. Engage (create a platform) Redirect (build pressure) Release (disengage).

Had sushi with Phil the other day and of course he got me thinking skiing!

 

[bud heishman]

Watch Bobs "Infinity move" again and you can visualize where the three phases of "Engage, Redirect, Release" occur. Let your mind go, and feel your center of mass take it's path and your Base of Support take it's path. Feel the transition from Redirecting to Releasing and letting inertia take over for a split second as your Cm moves from the inside of one turn to the other. Feel your edges change and engage lightly as you begin to build pressure and Redirect your course. Close your eyes and feel the continuous uninterrupted flow down the mountain. There is no harshness, no edge sets, no braking, just feel the pressure build progressively pushing you around the turn, then release as the legs soften allowing the Cm to move with inertia and your momentum carrying you across your feet chasing the fall line down the mountain.

Ahhh that felt good! Didn't even have to put my boots on.

 

[Chris Geib]

I think you should have at least put your boots on...