eBike Drones and eBikes!

[Rod9301]

A scooter that is owned and maintained by a company is different from an e-bike that you personally own. I could see geo-fencing being a feature for a rental fleet of e-bikes with no central parking...

E-scooters are tracked remotely since they are not parked in a secured building. So they already have continuous tracking with GPS and are thus 'easy' to geo-fence. The scooters share common hardware and software, so updates to geofence borders would be easier to enforce since the city is dealing with one owner. I would guess the GPS is decent, but will get confused at times, which could have injurious results if you are near the geofence boundary. So even doing this for a scooter could be problematic.

Implementing this tech on an e-bike is going to cost $$ and I don't think the customer will be interested in it as a feature. It would have to be mandated by law to make it into the product.

It really sounds like a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.

 

[scott43]

I ride a lot in Tahoe, on an Enduro e bike, and I'm not aware of any conflicts, ever.

Yeah come to Toronto and see how they work on sidewalks...

 

[Philpug]

Yeah come to Toronto and see how they work on sidewalks...

I do hear the scooters can be a problem. I know it has been an issue in South Lake Tahoe and Reno was still in a wait and see mode, if they were going to allow them here.

 

[Tom K.]

I'm no e-bike hater, but anything that make it easier to do something, and do it faster, is going to equal more users and more pressure.

In many areas, that won't matter, because the trail network isn't stressed or crowded. An example would be any trail I've ever ridden at any time around Butte, MT.

In other areas, it will matter, because the trail network doesn't need another single user over what is already present. My backyard trails in Post Canyon during May and June weekends would be an example of this.

Adding another user group -- any new group -- to an existing trail or road or path or whatever system calls for careful evaluation. In some areas, this is being done for e-bikes. In other areas, they are just being lumped in with regular bikes, which may or may not work out fine.

 

[Rod9301]

I'm no e-bike hater, but anything that make it easier to do something, and do it faster, is going to equal more users and more pressure.

In many areas, that won't matter, because the trail network isn't stressed or crowded. An example would be any trail I've ever ridden at any time around Butte, MT.

In other areas, it will matter, because the trail network doesn't need another single user over what is already present. My backyard trails in Post Canyon during May and June weekends would be an example of this.

Adding another user group -- any new group -- to an existing trail or road or path or whatever system calls for careful evaluation. In some areas, this is being done for e-bikes. In other areas, they are just being lumped in with regular bikes, which may or may not work out fine.

Well then, maybe you should help build new trails.

 

[scott43]

I do hear the scooters can be a problem. I know it has been an issue in South Lake Tahoe and Reno was still in a wait and see mode, if they were going to allow them here.

And it's partly just the stupidity here..they make no distinction between sizes. Like, the whole pedal thing is a leftover from mopeds. We're talking 40 years ago. So hard to get things modernized when it comes to gov't. We already have a huge number of people using bike paths here. I can only see bad things happening from introducing yet another transportation mode to those trails. I suppose they're here to stay. I just wish they'd force them to have plates and a license if they ride on the road..they're a moving chicane half the time.

 

[scott43]

Well then, maybe you should help build new trails.

??

 

[tball]

I think geofencing potentially solves a couple of problems.

First, there are places where e-bikes are prohibited. Geofencing could cut off the power in those areas.

Second, there are places where the current 750W e-bikes are too powerful. Geofencing could limit the power of e-bikes in those areas.

Brainstorming, maybe we could carve the country up into three types of appropriate e-bike usage:

• No power areas: limit the power to maybe 50 or 75 watts and 7.5 mph. That allows limping home and eliminates the danger of completely shutting down at a dangerous time.
• Low power areas: limit the power to 250 watts and speed to 15 mph like the EU. This would be the default when in an unknown area.
• High power areas: max of 750 watts and 20 mph as currently specified. Makes for high-speed motorized fun and fast commuting where appropriate.

Each local jurisdiction then gets to decide how e-bikes are used in their area.

Looks like the Consumer Product Safety Commission could change the current rules to require geofencing. That seems like a fair trade to me for allowing these motorized bikes to be exempt from motor vehicle laws:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_bicycle_laws#United_States

Maybe they should tackle scooters first, though.

 

[tball]

Update on my thoughts above:

It seems fairer to make the default high-power since that's what the large majority of the country will be. Allow local jurisdictions and landowners to mark their areas no-power and low-power if they choose. But, if there is not a good GPS fix (possibly due to tampering) revert to the low-power mode for the first 5 minutes then no-power after that.

Grandfather current e-bikes. Make the new geofencing rules apply to new bikes sold after X date.

 

[Tom K.]

Well then, maybe you should help build new trails.

Or maybe e-bike riders should attend work parties. I've yet to see one, and we have countless work parties every year.

 

[Mike Thomas]

If you want to get to the summit even more relaxed, you can activate shuttle mode, which calls up the full 410% support with less physical input. Thus, with just a small effort on the pedals, the motor will “push” the rider and bike uphill, nearing the 25 km/h cutout. However, you’ll lose the natural riding feel, not to mention battery power./QUOTE]

- A snippet from E-Mountainbike's review of the 2019 Specialized Turbo Levo

Yeah, really not 'motorized' at all... sure.

 

[Andy Mink]

I just wish they'd force them to have plates and a license if they ride on the road

I've said this for ALL bikes on the road. A small registration fee would help defray the cost of bike lanes or at least provide a small funding base to keep the lanes clean. The argument that I hear is most riders also have cars so therefore they're already paying road tax and registration. Well, that's all well and good but they're riding their bicycle today, not driving their car. I have to pay registration on trailers that I don't use everyday. I also get to pay a registration fee on my OHV vehicles (to DMV) for supposed trailhead maintenance etc. I don't even use those areas very often and none have been upgraded or improved yet either.

So, how many road cyclists would be willing to register their bikes? What about insurance? Just throwing it out there...

 

[Jwrags]

I've said this for ALL bikes on the road. A small registration fee would help defray the cost of bike lanes or at least provide a small funding base to keep the lanes clean. The argument that I hear is most riders also have cars so therefore they're already paying road tax and registration. Well, that's all well and good but they're riding their bicycle today, not driving their car. I have to pay registration on trailers that I don't use everyday. I also get to pay a registration fee on my OHV vehicles (to DMV) for supposed trailhead maintenance etc. I don't even use those areas very often and none have been upgraded or improved yet either.

So, how many road cyclists would be willing to register their bikes? What about insurance? Just throwing it out there...

Oregon now has a $15 tax on any bike that cost over $200 or with a 26" wheel to help fund bike stuff. If you are buying a nice bike then $15 is not too much to pay.

 

[Erik Timmerman]

Or maybe e-bike riders should attend work parties. I've yet to see one, and we have countless work parties every year.

Just wondering, how can you tell?

 

[tball]

I think geofencing work parties is a good idea too.

 

[Tom K.]

Just wondering, how can you tell?

Welcome to life in a REALLY small town!

 

[tball]

I came really close to hitting a hipster on a Lime scooter coming at me the wrong way on a one way street near downtown Denver yesterday. He wasn't wearing any protection except skinny jeans.

They really need to micro geofence scooters in urban areas. They could default to 2.5 mph max, and only get full power to 15 mph where it's safe and allowed by law. That same technology will then trickle down to bikes, with appropriate new regulations enacted.

That's my prediction. It might take a while, but it seems necessary and inevitable.

 

[Rod9301]

I came really close to hitting a hipster on a Lime scooter coming at me the wrong way on a one way street near downtown Denver yesterday. He wasn't wearing any protection except skinny jeans.

They really need to micro geofence scooters in urban areas. They could default to 2.5 mph max, and only get full power to 15 mph where it's safe and allowed by law. That same technology will then trickle down to bikes, with appropriate new regulations enacted.

That's my prediction. It might take a while, but it seems necessary and inevitable.

Why not do it for cars to?
As a matter of fact, for runners