Dedicated Left Ski and Right Ski

[AlpedHuez]

I see quite a few criticisms around of skis like the Ripsticks, where reviewers wish Elan would drop the Amphibio left ski / right ski scheme. So it has me wondering if it just a criticism of the ski construction itself as needlessly gimmicky, or more generally, about forcing skiers to put a certain ski on the left and on the right? In my personal experience, I like to be consistent on which skis are on which foot. So if it's an asymmetrical graphic design like the Rossi Heroes, I routinely have one on the left and one on the right. If it's the same graphic, I take the ski that's brakes rests on top of the other on my left. Do you have a routine like that? Or is there some advantage to rotating so you ride different edges from time to time?

 

[tch]

I think you'll get a lot of responses like this: if you rotate L/R skis, then you are rotating the inside (working edges). A shop tune will sharpen all four edges; if you switch skis regularly, then you get twice the life out of a tune (you use all four edges eventually as inside edges). Plus, if you ding or burr an edge, you can switch skis to put that compromised edge outside until you can get to fixing it.
Many of us have a routine; personally, I mark one ski and, all things being equal, every time I go in for coffee or lunch, I make sure to rotate/alternate skis when I come back out.

 

[Cheizz]

Besides wear on the edges, I find Amphibio in the Elan skis to be an overcompensation in the ski itself on top of what my legs are doing. When skiing, the inside leg adjusts pressure and compensates for the different (smaller) turn the inside leg is making (compared to the outside leg). You don't really have to think about it. It's automatic.
When I demo Amphibio skis, I have the feeling that that kind of compensation is built into the ski. But my body compensates also, which makes for a very weird and for me unpleasant experience. I don;t trust the inner ski. This is how I can best describe why I don't like Amphibio. It might be complete bullocks, this theory, but that's how it feels to me.

 

[AlpedHuez]

Besides wear on the edges, I find Amphibio in the Elan skis to be an overcompensation in the ski itself on top of what my legs are doing. When skiing, the inside leg adjusts pressure and compensates for the different (smaller) turn the inside leg is making (compared to the outside leg). You don't really have to think about it. It's automatic.
When I demo Amphibio skis, I have the feeling that that kind of compensation is built into the ski. But my body compensates also, which makes for a very weird and for me unpleasant experience. I don;t trust the inner ski. This is how I can best describe why I don't like Amphibio. It might be complete bullocks, this theory, but that's how it feels to me.

Excellent points, thank you.

 

[graham418]

I have always wondered , Can you sharpen the edges on Amphibio skis on the machine, or do you have to hand tune them?

 

[Analisa]

I had my doubts as well (every other ski I've ridden have been symmetrical, and I've had a good time on most of them). But I've been demoing a pair of Ripstick 102s and I it's definitely not just marketing. I can't see the rocker change, but I can feel it if I rub my hands along the bases and edges. Rocker profile is slightly different, but the outside edge also ends up being a touch thinner and softer.

On snow, I can feel a subtle difference between what each edge is doing, but it's not weird. I think for a progressing intermediate who has parallel turns and wants to take their skiing to the next level, it makes it easier and more intuitive to get forward and drive the tips. Turn initiation felt really easy like the Sheeva/Rustler line, but while the forward mount point, tight radius, and deep rocker lines on those two make them feel uncomfortable pointing down the fall line, the Ripsticks seemed more willing to make various turn shapes.

 

[Philpug]

I notice more of the Amphibio design when I get back onto a tradtionally designed ski. I think, "Boy, that Amphibio sure was easy to ski."

 

[Andy Mink]

I skied the Wingman 86CTI quite a bit this winter. Initially, you can feel the difference in the Amphibio rocker but you soon forget about it. Would the ski be as good without it? I don't know. It would be interesting to try a non-Amphibio Wingman. The ski itself is really good in lots of conditions. I'd rather just pop the skis on and go. I also don't care much for graphics that go across the skis. I don't care if I swap them but then I look like a noob.

 

[wooglin]

I have Ripsticks. I always drop the left ski first, on the left. And if I don’t have assymetrical skis I do the same because I always pick them up the same, right ski and then left ski, so the left ski is “on top” like for the OP.

Also, I notice immediately when I get on symmetrical skis. I feel the additional catch as I switch edges. And that is what feels “odd” to me.

 

[cantunamunch]

One of the things I liked about the Fischer Radarc series was that the outside sidecut was in front of the inside sidecut. There was no way not to notice getting the skis wrong on those.

 

[BS Slarver]

Just ordered a second pair of RS last week in the 106 and have 3 days touring on them, this after being on the 96 RS Black all season with 70 days.
The L R thingy is a no brainer and they are some of easiest, most fun skis I’ve been on in quite some time and I’ve demoed my fair share of the 90-110 offerings.
My tuner who uses a fully automated Montana doesn’t have a problem tuning them either. After weekly tunes (16-18) and hitting my share of Montana andesite all season and they are showing little wear.
If for some reason you get the L R wrong, no biggie, then they ski like most other skis their width.

 

[Marker]

Elan Amphibio 88 XTi have been my daily driver for the last few years, so I've become quite used to them. The rocker on the outside edge is obvious from the graphics on the front, so no confusion there when dropping them down on the snow. I went with these skis because they were suitable for a large man and had full camber on the inside edge. It was less about the rocker on the outside. I have skied them the "wrong" way, and found as recommended by posters here that they worked better in the bumps, but they seemed a little twitchy otherwise. I don't notice much switching to a cheater GS with mild rocker (Rossi Hero Elite LT), but I think that is masked by the latter's quickness edge-to-edge, at least at my modest skill level. For me, both are extremely stable rides, but I feel more comfortable at higher speeds on the Rossi's, so maybe there I'm picking up on the Amphibio design. As for tuning, I maintain them myself after letting a shop machine set the bevels at 1/3 about once a year with a base grind, so have not seen excess wear of the edges.

 

[François Pugh]

I don;t trust the inner ski. This is how I can best describe why I don't like Amphibio. It might be complete bullocks, this theory, but that's how it feels to me.

My theory: it's the rocker. I'm usually on my old Fischer SCs. With full rocker the leading edge of the skis let you know exactly what's going on. Ski frozen stuff and it's like I can feel every thing it hits through the nerves in my eye-teeth. With rocker, it's more of a "leap of faith", a tiny leap for for a Rossi Hero ST, a big leap for a Volkl 100-eight. Rocker for the inside ski at the same time as no rocker for the outside ski, I can see how there might be trust issues with the inside ski.

 

[Cheizz]

I thinks it's the rocker as well (the rocker on the outside edge on the inside ski) that causes my discomfort.

FWIW I do love the Elan GSX and SLX consumer racing skis. They have no Amphibio technology. A great flex pattern and lovely grip on hardpack, though.

 

[Marker]

I skied the Wingman 86CTI quite a bit this winter. Initially, you can feel the difference in the Amphibio rocker but you soon forget about it. Would the ski be as good without it? I don't know. It would be interesting to try a non-Amphibio Wingman. The ski itself is really good in lots of conditions. I'd rather just pop the skis on and go. I also don't care much for graphics that go across the skis. I don't care if I swap them but then I look like a noob.

I would like to demo this Wingman as I hear the latest iteration of Amphibio tech is better than the Gen 1 version I'm skiing. I could careless about the symmetry of the graphics, so I try to alternate edges on my other skis. @Analisa I do think these skis have helped me as a progressing intermediate on most of the mountain, but I still struggle in the bumps.

 

[SSSdave]

Although I've never thought it actually makes any performance difference, I've always marked skis and then worn them on specific sides. I crudely hand tune my skis frequently and do notice inside edges not surprisingly seeing more dings. After 15 days bump skiing on my new 2020 Santa Ana 88's, my edges and bottoms have had only very minor nicks and scratches. Like with other skis in the past, at some point may switch to the other edges.

 

[CascadeConcrete]

Besides wear on the edges, I find Amphibio in the Elan skis to be an overcompensation in the ski itself on top of what my legs are doing. ... But my body compensates also, which makes for a very weird and for me unpleasant experience. I don;t trust the inner ski.

I've had exactly the same experience demoing amphibio skis. They're fine if I'm just skidding, but when I want to get them up on edge and carve, the inner ski feels really weird and doesn't hook up the same as the outer ski. Maybe I'd get used to it if I skied them regularly, but I hate the feeling enough when I demo that I'd never buy one.

And on top of that, I prefer being able to split the edge wear across all four edges instead of two getting the brunt of it. I have no special system. I just figure if I don't think about it, random chance will have the skis spending roughly even time on each foot with roughly even edge wear.

Not a fan of asymmetric skis to the point where I will often not consider them.

 

[Andy Mink]

Maybe I'd get used to it if I skied them regularly

You do, to the point of not thinking about it. I do agree with your point about not being able to use all four edges equally.

 

[David Chaus]

Edge wear is less of an issue if you’re mostly using them off-piste. For example, my ON3P Billygoats have asymmetric tip taper, so a definite L and R ski. This is a powder ski that’s great in crud, and the more pronounced taper on the outside edge of the skis makes it more nimble and easier to release, while the less tapered inside edges hold a carve better than any other wide or powder ski I’ve tried. Given the conditions it’s used in (not predominantly hardpack) the edges aren’t likely to see as much wear as my daily drivers.

 

[ski otter 2]

Edge wear is less of an issue if you’re mostly using them off-piste. For example, my ON3P Billygoats have asymmetric tip taper, so a definite L and R ski. This is a powder ski that’s great in crud, and the more pronounced taper on the outside edge of the skis makes it more nimble and easier to release, while the less tapered inside edges hold a carve better than any other wide or powder ski I’ve tried. Given the conditions it’s used in (not predominantly hardpack) the edges aren’t likely to see as much wear as my daily drivers.

For me, the ON3P Billy Goats have a different feel and dynamic from the Elans, not sure why. I like the Billy Goats a lot, am always almost buying them. I really don't notice the different symmetry there, maybe because to me it feels so dialed in, integrated. I just notice the Billy Goats work, in both soft snow and on soft groomers.

The Elans, on the other hand, don't work for me in a way I enjoy, at least from demoing. @Cheizz, your first description really partly explained and described why I don't like them.
In addition, for me they feel grabby, bossy, maybe - they want to tell you how and when to turn, whereas I have no problem turning, on a good ski, and like to make my own choices in this regard.
At times, a slightly "off" tune will create a bossy-feeling ski; and some ski models just have that over-grabby feel to them naturally. (For example, my Rossi Experience 98s could easily feel grabby even though with them it was in a way I liked, often.)