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Monique

bounceswoosh
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As the wise Yogi Berra’s should have said: ‘Skiing is 90 percent mental. The other half is physical’

I heard it differently. "Skiing is 90% mental; the rest is in your head."
 

PTskier

Been goin' downhill for years....
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I was chatting with a ski buddy this morning. The topic of jumps came up. He is stuck on the fear of standing at a lip, then jumping in. He knows that all he has to do is balance. He can balance. He knows that. He's fit...he's an accomplished rock climber. He can do all that, and he freezes at a jump that he's technically fully capable of nailing. He's worried about snagging the ski tails and then dumping. I can't imagine how that could happen...maybe if one is way, way in the back seat, which he isn't.

So, my duty when we're skiing together for 3 days at Whistler next month is to hound him until he jumps. I'm not a jumper, but I do it when needed. Just go into it and balance. That's about it. Flex to absorb the landing, but just balance. I'll pester him until he tells me to stop yapping about it, and he does it. That'll work for the two of us. That's not how I'd do it with anyone else.
 

Monique

bounceswoosh
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I was chatting with a ski buddy this morning. The topic of jumps came up. He is stuck on the fear of standing at a lip, then jumping in. He knows that all he has to do is balance. He can balance. He knows that. He's fit...he's an accomplished rock climber. He can do all that, and he freezes at a jump that he's technically fully capable of nailing. He's worried about snagging the ski tails and then dumping. I can't imagine how that could happen...maybe if one is way, way in the back seat, which he isn't.

So, my duty when we're skiing together for 3 days at Whistler next month is to hound him until he jumps. I'm not a jumper, but I do it when needed. Just go into it and balance. That's about it. Flex to absorb the landing, but just balance. I'll pester him until he tells me to stop yapping about it, and he does it. That'll work for the two of us. That's not how I'd do it with anyone else.

I'm not sure rock climbing directly translates to jumping.

How big of a jump are we talking? I've scoped a cornice close-up, then backed away and skied toward it so that I'm not trying to "jump" from a standstill. Of course that's hard.
 

karlo

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He is stuck on the fear of standing at a lip, then jumping in.

very reasonable to be concerned.

backed away and skied toward it so that I'm not trying to "jump" from a standstill.

very reasonable solution.

On a jump I took, perhaps 5 feet, 6?, landing was on hardpack, and flatter than I expected. Went forward, and crack. Tore a gastroc muscle. So, know what you're landing in, know possible outcomes and be confident you can handle the outcomes. The above event was at the top of a tram, on the first ride up of the day, on the first day.
 

karlo

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He's worried about snagging the ski tails and then dumping. I can't imagine how that could happen...

oh, one more thing. I saw that happen, at Whistler actually. The guy's tails hit an outcropping of snow, the guy went tumbling. So, maybe rather than encourage your buddy to jump, it might be better to discuss possibilities that may happen, and go through what the reaction plan is. Once he is confident that all bases are covered, he will no doubt do it.
 

Monique

bounceswoosh
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oh, one more thing. I saw that happen, at Whistler actually. The guy's tails hit an outcropping of snow, the guy went tumbling. So, maybe rather than encourage your buddy to jump, it might be better to discuss possibilities that may happen, and go through what the reaction plan is. Once he is confident that all bases are covered, he will no doubt do it.

This is @dean_spirito 's area of expertise, not mine, but tail slap is a lot less likely if you're in a strong athletic forward/neutral stance.
 

john petersen

working through minutia to find the big picture!
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for me, starting small to familiarize someone to the movement patterns necessary to pull off a big jump will help a great deal. Then, you dont have to deal with too many issues while standing at the top of a big cornice. If you have built up to it, the other issues have already been dealt with in a natural and progressive way. The only thing left to do after that progression, is jump in!

skills are best acquired through familiarity and challenge. you can engineer the little failures along the way so that success is the outcome.....but it should be done with the appropriate level of challenge.....you can only read that based on the situation. at some point, yes, he just has to DO it....but that IT can be guided and engineered for success....

JP
 
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AmyPJ

AmyPJ

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I had a great time skiing in Grand Targhee, and came away with a few notables.
1) fear makes you aft, and and does not work well on steeper terrain (as we all know, and I knew, but didn't realize how aft I get on it.)
2) I need to widen my stance.
3) my fear is mostly related to not having the confidence/skill set to comfortably get down something.
My frustration last season came from the fact that I COULD get down some steeps fairly well the season prior. But fear in my life translated to fear on the hill, which made me ski more defensively than ever.

I'll probably always be a lot more cautious than most. That's just how I'm wired. I aim to be a very beautiful, competent skier, not a fast skier. So many people equate speed with higher skill set, and as we all know, that's not the case in many instances. I know that as my skill set improves and my confidence comes back, my speed will naturally follow.
Just a taste of winter from Targhee. Neat shot taken from a video--I'm digging my new red Outdoor Research jacket. :D
23561499_10215006315337670_1916794998326834471_n.jpg
 

Monique

bounceswoosh
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1) fear makes you aft, and and does not work well on steeper terrain (as we all know, and I knew, but didn't realize how aft I get on it.)

I don't think I understand "aft" in this sentence - explain?
 

Rod9301

Making fresh tracks
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I had a great time skiing in Grand Targhee, and came away with a few notables.
1) fear makes you aft, and and does not work well on steeper terrain (as we all know, and I knew, but didn't realize how aft I get on it.)
2) I need to widen my stance.
3) my fear is mostly related to not having the confidence/skill set to comfortably get down something.
My frustration last season came from the fact that I COULD get down some steeps fairly well the season prior. But fear in my life translated to fear on the hill, which made me ski more defensively than ever.

I'll probably always be a lot more cautious than most. That's just how I'm wired. I aim to be a very beautiful, competent skier, not a fast skier. So many people equate speed with higher skill set, and as we all know, that's not the case in many instances. I know that as my skill set improves and my confidence comes back, my speed will naturally follow.
Just a taste of winter from Targhee. Neat shot taken from a video--I'm digging my new red Outdoor Research jacket. :D
23561499_10215006315337670_1916794998326834471_n.jpg
Do not widen your stance when it's steep, you will put too much weight on the uphill ski.
 

Monique

bounceswoosh
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aft = weight aft = backseat
Shying away from the hill.

:doh:

For a brief moment, I somehow thought "aft" was forward because ... I have no explanation.
 

Don Duran

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Actually stance width on steep terrain needs to be seen through a wider filter than horzontal leg to leg separation. There is also vertical separation and lead induced separation. So Amy is quite correct in saying stance width widens as a function of the relationship between us and the snow surface. Think long leg short leg. I still remember a high traverse at Taos where my 5'4" wife struggled to keep her downhill ski on the snow since her uphill leg was fully flexed and the slope required that much vertical separation. She hated me for days for taking her on that route.
 

karlo

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tail slap is a lot less likely if you're in a strong athletic forward/neutral stance

Which is why I like your solution.
Edit: Also, I think rock climbers appreciate and seek out solutions to technical challenges before an attempt at a piece of something consequential. Your solution also simplifies the problem.

fear makes you aft

don't think I understand "aft" in this sentence -

typo? daft? :roflmao:
 
Last edited:

john petersen

working through minutia to find the big picture!
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yes, Don nails it....some folks dont equate "long leg/short leg" with a wide stance...some do...but either way, it is very functional on steeps and allows for a smooth turn transition.....if you have the right mindset!. Its sort of a hori-vertical separation.... ;) transitioning weight from the old downhill (long) leg, by extending and committing to the slope onto that new downhill (old uphill) ski as you begin to make it long is a real hoot!...it almost feels like weightlessness and flying....a childhood dream of mine...Who didnt want the ability to fly as a kid?....

anyway that old downhill ski/leg shortens progressively and appropriately to the steepness of the slope so that you can keep a stable upper body that is in a position to keep moving down the hill and into the next turn.....if the movements are progressive and not rushed or too slow it can be very enjoyable.....the turns sometimes feel like they are happening upside down....hard to explain...but if you get on your edges early enough, it almost feels like you are making arcs in a nearly uphill direction.
(some call this slow line fast...)

Once you can achieve this blend of skills and movements, you will begin building confidence very quickly as it allows you to tackle many different kinds of slopes. and it works in quite a few snow conditions as well.....

I guess it could be considered the opposite of inclination....leaning uphill......stiff legged and in the back seat, too much on your inside ski, ect....

JP
 

Rod9301

Making fresh tracks
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Jan 11, 2016
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yes, Don nails it....some folks dont equate "long leg/short leg" with a wide stance...some do...but either way, it is very functional on steeps and allows for a smooth turn transition.....if you have the right mindset!. Its sort of a hori-vertical separation.... ;) transitioning weight from the old downhill (long) leg, by extending and committing to the slope onto that new downhill (old uphill) ski as you begin to make it long is a real hoot!...it almost feels like weightlessness and flying....a childhood dream of mine...Who didnt want the ability to fly as a kid?....

anyway that old downhill ski/leg shortens progressively and appropriately to the steepness of the slope so that you can keep a stable upper body that is in a position to keep moving down the hill and into the next turn.....if the movements are progressive and not rushed or too slow it can be very enjoyable.....the turns sometimes feel like they are happening upside down....hard to explain...but if you get on your edges early enough, it almost feels like you are making arcs in a nearly uphill direction.
(some call this slow line fast...)

Once you can achieve this blend of skills and movements, you will begin building confidence very quickly as it allows you to tackle many different kinds of slopes. and it works in quite a few snow conditions as well.....

I guess it could be considered the opposite of inclination....leaning uphill......stiff legged and in the back seat, too much on your inside ski, ect....

JP
Sure, my comment is strictly in the separation between skis horizontally. Of course you will have a lot of vertical separation.
 

Monique

bounceswoosh
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Colorado
I think fear moves the CM uphill. Sometimes that's "aft," but more often it's back and on the uphill ski, which makes turn initiation a bit of a challenge.

Yes, that's my issue! I don't ski in the back seat. It took me a long time to realize that even though I'm not in the back seat, I'm still leaning uphill and causing myself problems. It wasn't the "fall line" part of the turn that was the issue. Now I look at any photo of me on anything moderately steep (let alone REALLY steep), and it's obvious.

04QRqNL.jpg
 

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