• For more information on how to avoid pop-up ads and still support SkiTalk click HERE.

Daleboots anyone or alternate boot suggestions?

vindibona1

Getting on the lift
Instructor
Joined
Jan 22, 2020
Posts
174
Location
Northern Illinoi
My tale of woe... As a teen I was run over by a drunk driver, snapping my left leg literally in two. Two years later the bones healed (after two surgeries), but left two screws in my shin and a partially fused left ankle. Over the years I have figured out the "recipe" of boot adjustments to allow me to ski, but with some limitations (big bumps skied at hard).

The last pair of boots I purchased roughly 16 years ago; Salomon XWave 8.0 (measured 90 flex at the time). I am a "light touch" skier who has learned to ski mostly from the bottoms of my feet. I have made a few tweaks to my orthotics which basically allow me to "twitch my feet" when I want my skis to turn. Because of my injury I do not use a lot of forward cuff pressure, nor do I like boots cuffs that are either too straight up, or have too much forward angle. Ramp angle is important as I can get more range of motion in my ankle if my left heel is elevated a bit. If the boots are too stiff and I hit something suddenly it maxes out my ankel and sends shock-waves through my body. Consequently I have learned to be very technically finessed skier, but my turns are still aggressive. I think I use the forward flex of the boot cuff as shock absorption as much as forward pressure. With my Salomons, rather than tighten the top buckle fully, I leave it and the velcro power strap on the looser side and use an eleastic "Booster" strap to add more power and shock absoption. My light touch, I believe, is what's allowed my boots to go 16 seasons without breaking. But the liners are breaking down and there's no point in putting new ones in aging shells. In consideration of the width of my feet, I in athletic shoes I wear a men's 11EE (and am in 27.5 ski boots currently) so effectively downsized from street shoes. I know that boot companies are now advertising "last sizes" which didn't exist 16 years ago.

But here I am, 16 years after my last boot purchase. Boot design has changed and I haven't kept up with it. But years and years ago, when I had just progressed out of the beginner stages of skiing, I owned one of the original pairs of Daleboots. I liked the idea and the wrap around cuff was a blessing for my damaged shin area (I can send photos, but not for the weak of stomach). I could take a stab at a pair of Daleboots, but they're not available locally, so I'd have to spend at least 4 days in SLC to get fitted, and test/adjust them. And while there are a few shops in the areas with other brands, I don't know of any bootfitters I truly trust. The guy I worked with for many years has left the industry and I'm in a quandary.

So, I'm still thinking Daleboot, but to even try them on there is a plane and hotel expense involved, plus car rental and a couple days' lift tickets involved... minimum $2000. Any thoughts on Daleboot or other new-fangled boot technologies that I should be looking into?

Please forgive the long post.
 

BS Slarver

Making fresh tracks
Skier
Joined
Nov 20, 2015
Posts
1,530
Location
Biggest skiing in America
Heck, if your in that price point and need to go to Utah consider the Strolz cabrio - looks intriguing. With your foot issues, width and size shouldn’t be an issue
 

chilehed

Out on the slopes
Skier
SkiTalk Supporter
Joined
Sep 13, 2017
Posts
885
Location
Michigan
I love my Daleboots, and they're pretty strong in their claim to be able to fit anybody. You can probably give them some measurements in advance.

You can save a bundle on lodging if you stay at the Camelot Hostel. $33 a night last I checked, beds aren't the most comfortable but it's quiet, the showers are hot and there's a cooking area. And the burrito stand down the street (Tacos El Toro) is great.

SLC is my favorite ski trip.
 
Last edited:

crgildart

Gravity Slave
Skier
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
16,495
Location
The Bull City
Though used boots are not an option for someone with really custom needs... It's quite a testament to Daleboot that it's almost impossible to find a used pair of them for sale. Once people try them, they're hooked and don't sell them. Everybody loves them.
 
Thread Starter
TS
vindibona1

vindibona1

Getting on the lift
Instructor
Joined
Jan 22, 2020
Posts
174
Location
Northern Illinoi
Strolz cabrio

I'll have to look them up. Never heard of them.... But that doesn't mean anything. My Salomons have just worked. The funny thing is, that when I bought these XWaves 16 years ago, I went to the shop, tried them on and didn't buy them (at first) because they were too comfortable and I thought something was amiss. It took two more trips to the store to convince me that I was just experiencing a comfort level I hadn't experienced before. In fact, the liners were heat-moldable... but never needed anything. They fit perfectly right out of the box! I did have the soles ground at Les Moise in Wisconsin. Since then I've had a knee replacement (yeah, the shock from an inflexible ankle took its toll on my knee :(. ) The Doc straightened out my alignment and now the soles are also slightly off from before :).

I love my Daleboots, and they're pretty strong in their claim to be able to fit anybody. You can probably give them some measurements in advance.

You can save a bundle on lodging if you stay at the Camelot Hostel. $33 a night last I checked, beds aren't the most comfortable but it's quiet, the showers are hot and there's a cooking area. And the burrito stand down the street (Tacos El Toro) is great.

SLC is my favorite ski trip.

I used to ski at Snowbird regularly, but haven't been to SLC for years, so have forgotten the geography. Where is Camelot Hostel? I recall staying in the old 1-floor motel rooms at Little America where the car was parked right in front of the room. It's been some time. Do you have a website or contact info for Camelot?
 

Uncle-A

In the words of Paul Simon "You can call me Al"
Skier
Joined
Dec 22, 2015
Posts
10,979
Location
NJ
We had a thread about a new rear entry boot for the 2019 - 2020 season. Sorry I don't remember the brand but I am sure someone here could come up with the name. Another thought might be the three part shell like a Delbello and a wrap liner.
 

Winks

AKA "Gary".
Industry Insider
SkiTalk Tester
SkiTalk Supporter
Joined
Feb 10, 2018
Posts
461
Location
CA
My tale of woe... As a teen I was run over by a drunk driver, snapping my left leg literally in two. Two years later the bones healed (after two surgeries), but left two screws in my shin and a partially fused left ankle. Over the years I have figured out the "recipe" of boot adjustments to allow me to ski, but with some limitations (big bumps skied at hard).

The last pair of boots I purchased roughly 16 years ago; Salomon XWave 8.0 (measured 90 flex at the time). I am a "light touch" skier who has learned to ski mostly from the bottoms of my feet. I have made a few tweaks to my orthotics which basically allow me to "twitch my feet" when I want my skis to turn. Because of my injury I do not use a lot of forward cuff pressure, nor do I like boots cuffs that are either too straight up, or have too much forward angle. Ramp angle is important as I can get more range of motion in my ankle if my left heel is elevated a bit. If the boots are too stiff and I hit something suddenly it maxes out my ankel and sends shock-waves through my body. Consequently I have learned to be very technically finessed skier, but my turns are still aggressive. I think I use the forward flex of the boot cuff as shock absorption as much as forward pressure. With my Salomons, rather than tighten the top buckle fully, I leave it and the velcro power strap on the looser side and use an eleastic "Booster" strap to add more power and shock absoption. My light touch, I believe, is what's allowed my boots to go 16 seasons without breaking. But the liners are breaking down and there's no point in putting new ones in aging shells. In consideration of the width of my feet, I in athletic shoes I wear a men's 11EE (and am in 27.5 ski boots currently) so effectively downsized from street shoes. I know that boot companies are now advertising "last sizes" which didn't exist 16 years ago.

But here I am, 16 years after my last boot purchase. Boot design has changed and I haven't kept up with it. But years and years ago, when I had just progressed out of the beginner stages of skiing, I owned one of the original pairs of Daleboots. I liked the idea and the wrap around cuff was a blessing for my damaged shin area (I can send photos, but not for the weak of stomach). I could take a stab at a pair of Daleboots, but they're not available locally, so I'd have to spend at least 4 days in SLC to get fitted, and test/adjust them. And while there are a few shops in the areas with other brands, I don't know of any bootfitters I truly trust. The guy I worked with for many years has left the industry and I'm in a quandary.

So, I'm still thinking Daleboot, but to even try them on there is a plane and hotel expense involved, plus car rental and a couple days' lift tickets involved... minimum $2000. Any thoughts on Daleboot or other new-fangled boot technologies that I should be looking into?

Please forgive the long post.

First, Welcome!

Next, thank you for the long post as it gave a lot of insight and information towards your particular situation. While not as extreme I have been in a similar situation for quite a few years now. I broke my tibia a few years back that required multiple surgeries to get corrected and had trouble with shin and ankle pressure for a long time. At this point I will only ski in a three piece design boot, which oddly enough I was in when I broke my leg, that aside the flexibility of the boot and reduced pressure on my shin allows me to ski as if I was never injured at all. Now while I cannot guarantee my case of boot success for everyone, I certainly can help you go over all your options if you are willing to come out to the Bay Area/Berkeley.
At this point Dale is always a good option if you are willing to spend the time and money, you could go directly to them or an authorized dealer such as the shop I work through. Next you have the three piece design boots, Dalbello & Full tilt, both have their advantages and disadvantages but I would never say one is better than the other. Someone earlier also mentioned a Strolz boot but I am not sure what that would cost, probably the same as Dale I imagine but still a option.
Lastly you have some boots coming to market from Nordica that is a rear entry that kind of has a smooth flex with minimal shin pressure. At this point I would put that as my last option as that is not exactly the best performance option.
 
Thread Starter
TS
vindibona1

vindibona1

Getting on the lift
Instructor
Joined
Jan 22, 2020
Posts
174
Location
Northern Illinoi
ut123.com

Thanks. I think I found them.

We had a thread about a new rear entry boot for the 2019 - 2020 season. Sorry I don't remember the brand but I am sure someone here could come up with the name. Another thought might be the three part shell like a Delbello and a wrap liner.

I saw something recently about a Kastinger "lever action" boot. That certainly wouldn't be for me. My approach to skiing requires very little forward pressure, but LEVERAGE, generated by the foot pressing down on a "balance point" under the foot, then leveraging my ankle/lower leg into the side and front of the boot in sort of a 45° vector. Additional ski tip pressure is generated from my toes, with my orthotic beefed up under my toes with layers of tape. This extra toe support seems to help counter the extra ramp angle I need to compensate for very limited dorsiflexion.

I hope not to gross anyone out, but here is are two pics illustrating the issues I'm faced with. I've left it in thumbnail form so as not to shove it in peoples' faces. Click on the thumbnail for a larger image if you really want to see the issues. I was told I'd never be able to ski- at all.
foot_flexion_illustration.jpg
 

Winks

AKA "Gary".
Industry Insider
SkiTalk Tester
SkiTalk Supporter
Joined
Feb 10, 2018
Posts
461
Location
CA
Thanks. I think I found them.



I saw something recently about a Kastinger "lever action" boot. That certainly wouldn't be for me. My approach to skiing requires very little forward pressure, but LEVERAGE, generated by the foot pressing down on a "balance point" under the foot, then leveraging my ankle/lower leg into the side and front of the boot in sort of a 45° vector. Additional ski tip pressure is generated from my toes, with my orthotic beefed up under my toes with layers of tape. This extra toe support seems to help counter the extra ramp angle I need to compensate for very limited dorsiflexion.

I hope not to gross anyone out, but here is are two pics illustrating the issues I'm faced with. I've left it in thumbnail form so as not to shove it in peoples' faces. Click on the thumbnail for a larger image if you really want to see the issues. I was told I'd never be able to ski- at all.
View attachment 91073

Definitely not the worst I have ever seen, I can get you into boots!
 
Thread Starter
TS
vindibona1

vindibona1

Getting on the lift
Instructor
Joined
Jan 22, 2020
Posts
174
Location
Northern Illinoi
First, Welcome!

Next, thank you for the long post as it gave a lot of insight and information towards your particular situation. While not as extreme I have been in a similar situation for quite a few years now. I broke my tibia a few years back that required multiple surgeries to get corrected and had trouble with shin and ankle pressure for a long time. At this point I will only ski in a three piece design boot, which oddly enough I was in when I broke my leg, that aside the flexibility of the boot and reduced pressure on my shin allows me to ski as if I was never injured at all. Now while I cannot guarantee my case of boot success for everyone, I certainly can help you go over all your options if you are willing to come out to the Bay Area/Berkeley.
At this point Dale is always a good option if you are willing to spend the time and money, you could go directly to them or an authorized dealer such as the shop I work through. Next you have the three piece design boots, Dalbello & Full tilt, both have their advantages and disadvantages but I would never say one is better than the other. Someone earlier also mentioned a Strolz boot but I am not sure what that would cost, probably the same as Dale I imagine but still a option.
Lastly you have some boots coming to market from Nordica that is a rear entry that kind of has a smooth flex with minimal shin pressure. At this point I would put that as my last option as that is not exactly the best performance option.

Thanks Winks. I appreciate your detailed response.

Hoping not to gross anyone out, just before I saw your reply I posted an illustration of my general issue. Fortunately I retain most of the range of motion laterally and can extend my foot almost fully. I've explored surgical options to fix my ankle, but my fear is that while they might be able to increase the range of motion, it might be at the expense of increased pain in flexing more. As you might be able to see in my avatar, I can get down the hill pretty well as is... with a few boot modifications.

It took me a VERY long time to figure out what works for me. What I discovered mostly is that I have very little margin for error and all the angles of flex, alignment, ramp angle, shaft angle must be spot-on. I've learned a lot about boot fitting over the years, but haven't kept track of the new developments. Shell molding is new to me. Before one might be able to blow out the side of a boot. Also my foot has grown wider over the years and one thing that boot mfrs hadn't done before is list boot "last" sizes.

I was looking at the Full Tilt boots. Before I was in the Salomons I skied on Raichles for a time. I owned two different Raichle designs, but neither had the perfect last for my foot and I had no clue about boot fitting at the time (nor proper ski techinque). There is a shop about an hour from where I live that carries Full Tilt. Perhaps I should pay them a visit.

Still, Daleboot looks like it might be the best bet for me. It might be best that I go to them in SLC so they can get me fitted, then I can ski and come back to them for fine adjustments while I'm still there. I did own a pair of Daleboots when they first came out many years ago. The shell design was brilliant, but the injected rubber liner was far too generic and didn't work for me. But now... WOW!

Thanks again for your reply.
 

Winks

AKA "Gary".
Industry Insider
SkiTalk Tester
SkiTalk Supporter
Joined
Feb 10, 2018
Posts
461
Location
CA
Thanks Winks. I appreciate your detailed response.

Hoping not to gross anyone out, just before I saw your reply I posted an illustration of my general issue. Fortunately I retain most of the range of motion laterally and can extend my foot almost fully. I've explored surgical options to fix my ankle, but my fear is that while they might be able to increase the range of motion, it might be at the expense of increased pain in flexing more. As you might be able to see in my avatar, I can get down the hill pretty well as is... with a few boot modifications.

It took me a VERY long time to figure out what works for me. What I discovered mostly is that I have very little margin for error and all the angles of flex, alignment, ramp angle, shaft angle must be spot-on. I've learned a lot about boot fitting over the years, but haven't kept track of the new developments. Shell molding is new to me. Before one might be able to blow out the side of a boot. Also my foot has grown wider over the years and one thing that boot mfrs hadn't done before is list boot "last" sizes.

I was looking at the Full Tilt boots. Before I was in the Salomons I skied on Raichles for a time. I owned two different Raichle designs, but neither had the perfect last for my foot and I had no clue about boot fitting at the time (nor proper ski techinque). There is a shop about an hour from where I live that carries Full Tilt. Perhaps I should pay them a visit.

Still, Daleboot looks like it might be the best bet for me. It might be best that I go to them in SLC so they can get me fitted, then I can ski and come back to them for fine adjustments while I'm still there. I did own a pair of Daleboots when they first came out many years ago. The shell design was brilliant, but the injected rubber liner was far too generic and didn't work for me. But now... WOW!

Thanks again for your reply.

Check out the wider Full Tilt, the Descendant series. They start out pretty flat as well, unlike the original mold which has a ton of ramp angle.
Dale is still a great option, go to Salt Lake City those guys will really take care of you. They have worked with me for years to create miracles for many. Check their schedule as I have not spoken with them in a few weeks on their time frame. Adam and Steve will do the best they can for sure.
 
Thread Starter
TS
vindibona1

vindibona1

Getting on the lift
Instructor
Joined
Jan 22, 2020
Posts
174
Location
Northern Illinoi
Check out the wider Full Tilt, the Descendant series. They start out pretty flat as well, unlike the original mold which has a ton of ramp angle.
Dale is still a great option, go to Salt Lake City those guys will really take care of you. They have worked with me for years to create miracles for many. Check their schedule as I have not spoken with them in a few weeks on their time frame. Adam and Steve will do the best they can for sure.

As far as the Full Tilt boots go... In years past I owned two different pairs of Raichle Flexon boots. The taller ramp angle helps me, especially on the left side. I went to one of our local shops this afternoon and tried on some boots; Lange, Tecnica, Nordica, Salomon. Unfortunately the shop had a limited selection in my size (27.5). Of all the boots, the Langes seemed to have a close enough fit and were pretty cheap with my shop discount. What I discovered was that a boot with too wide of a last makes it difficult for me to just roll over on the edges from my feet. The Langes were pretty good in that regard.

They had a sample of an "Intuition liner" and was shocked to see it was the same heat-molded liner that Raichle came out with about 20 years ago, seemingly just rebranded. I tried it and it was comfortable, but I didn't know enough about boot fitting at the time to get any performance out of it. I think they molded it as if the liner itself would be the orthotic. I guess it reflects the adage "The more things change the more they stay the same".
 

Rod9301

Making fresh tracks
Skier
Joined
Jan 11, 2016
Posts
2,482
I went to a shop in South lake Tahoe that sold daleboots
I wanted to try them on to see how they flexed.
The owner refused to let me try them. Said you have to commit to buying them.

Wtf?
Probably because a lot of people would try them and then decide it's not for them.
 

Erik Timmerman

So much better than a pro
Instructor
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
6,357
One of my friends had a ski accident resulting in a broken leg that was classified as "partial amputation". Kind of a weird name because his whole leg is still there, but it took years of surgeries and his leg looks pretty bad, crooked with big lumps of bone. AT one point they considered giving up and just cutting it off. Anyway, he is having success with a Fischer Vacuum mold boot. His problems are different from yours, so I don't know if that helps, but he wasn't sure he'd be able to ski again before he got into that boot.
 

Philpug

Notorious P.U.G.
Admin
SkiTalk Tester
Joined
Nov 1, 2015
Posts
42,929
Location
Reno, eNVy
I went to a shop in South lake Tahoe that sold daleboots
I wanted to try them on to see how they flexed.
The owner refused to let me try them. Said you have to commit to buying them.

Wtf?
Probably because a lot of people would try them and then decide it's not for them.
Says more about him as a business person than Daleboot as a product.
 

David

"Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati"
Skier
Joined
Oct 14, 2017
Posts
1,401
Location
Holland, MI
I went to a shop in South lake Tahoe that sold daleboots
I wanted to try them on to see how they flexed.
The owner refused to let me try them. Said you have to commit to buying them.

Wtf?
Probably because a lot of people would try them and then decide it's not for them.
When I bought mine at the main SLC location/factory they don't have a "stock" boot to try on. The only way to try them is to have a pair made for your exact foot. But I have not met anyone yet that has tried them that didn't love them.
 

LiquidFeet

instructor
Instructor
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
6,726
Location
New England
....But I have not met anyone yet that has tried them that didn't love them.
I know someone who had Daleboots custom made from measurements taken by a competent bootfitter. They ended up being too wide. He returned them and got a full refund. I had heard prior to that that Dale's molds tended toward the wide side and that they can't fix that since the molds are not going to be changed.
 

DanoT

RVer-Skier
Skier
SkiTalk Supporter
Joined
Nov 12, 2015
Posts
4,807
Location
Sun Peaks B.C. in winter, Victoria B.C. in summer
@vindibona1, your boots are 16 years old, but how old are your skis? There are more and more very light weight but still high performance skis these days; something that could have a positive impact on knees and ankles.
 

Sponsor

Staff online

Top