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Colorado Cirque headwall preparation

robert57

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I thought I might tap the wisdom of the crowd about cirque headwall at Snowmass.

I'd really like to ski something off the top of the cirque poma but want a reality check and some advice on preparation. First some background, I am good, if slow, skier of a mature age who can ski black bumps runs with ease. I have not skied a lot of gladed areas. I will be back in Snowmass in Jan and have booked another 4 day bumps course at Aspen mountain.I have watched numerous youtube videos which don’t make this area look as steep as I suspect it might be, I assume its steep. I also appreciate the vagaries of the weather and snowpack limit the access to the area and would only attempt it on a clear day . I certainly don’t want to go in unprepared and am likely to be guided by friends who have skied the area before and tried to encourage me to join them.

So apart from the need for some sort of guide (friends or a pro) my questions for the first time up there are;

1. Is there a way down that is a good starting point to get a feel for the area?

2. What areas at snowmass should I be skiing comfortably before any attempt on the cirque?

3. Is the exit through the trees at the bottom the tricky part?

All suggestions or tips on preparing are welcomed.
 

mdf

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I haven't been to Aspen since the Gathering 3 or 4 years years ago, but at the time I thought the Cirque was a reasonable stretch goal for upper intermediates, provided the visibility and snow conditions were good. I was planning to lead an adventure down the headwall. But the snow did not cooperate and we canceled.

So yeah, if conditions are good, it is a good introduction to that kind of terrain.

To tell the truth, I don't remember what the exit is like.
 

Unpiste

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It could have used more snow on the exposed portions near the top, but the terrain was definitely manageable.

Screen Shot 2019-10-28 at 10.06.31 PM.jpg IMG_2325.JPG
Screen Shot 2019-10-28 at 10.07.12 PM.jpg IMG_2338.JPG
 

Seldomski

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I did it last year. Lots of snow during first week of January. Snow conditions were ideal with great visibility.

Top was chalky steepish. Similar to whales tail area at breck. The runout felt more challenging. Very irregular large moguls with rocks and trees in the runout. So, not much room to navigate. I stayed high on skiers left in the valley, which maybe was a mistake?

Top is definitely the easy part and was enjoyable to me. The runout felt more like 'adventure skiing' to me. Not much flow to it and more about hacking my way through. I couldn't see very far ... so I was going really slow not knowing if there are sudden drops.

On runout I stayed skiers left in the valley. Maybe other side is easier? I only did the run once. It was worth it to go up the poma and hike to the top of the ridge and look around. But doing laps there seemed like a waste - there's a lot of other fun terrain that was easier to get to.
 
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Lofcaudio

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@robert57 , what days will you be at Aspen? I will be skiing there January 12 - 15 and plan to hit 2 days at Snowmass, then a day each at Ajax and Highlands. I too am intrigued by the Cirque and Hanging Valley Glades as I've never ventured into those areas when at Snowmass. (Incidentally, you just referenced my Telluride video in the Telluride thread. It seems we have similar taste in ski areas.)

My ambitious goal for this January is to hit the Triple Crown of Aspen: Highland Bowl, the Cirque, and Hanging Valley. Hopefully, they will all be in good shape that early in the season.
 

Seldomski

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2. What areas at snowmass should I be skiing comfortably before any attempt on the cirque?

3. Is the exit through the trees at the bottom the tricky part?

If you can ski Freefall or West Face under the Sheer Bliss lift at Snowmass, then you should be fine. They are about as steep as Cirque Headwall gets. The exit through the trees at the base of those is also similarly... annoying. The trees are not especially close together for either Cirque Headwall vs Garrett Gulch (at least for the path I took at the base of Cirque Headwall - YMMV).

Cirque headwall is steep in a few spots, but it flattens out between. I didn't notice any exposed rocks/cliffs off Cirque Headwall, or any chokes when I skied it Jan 2019. I'm not really sure what makes it double black. I guess with less coverage or poorer snow conditions, it becomes much more dangerous?
 
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mdf

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I'm not really sure what makes it double black.
I think it is double black to discourage the clueless, since it is such an obvious trophy run.
Hanging Valley is steeper and narrower (though shorter) than the Cirque.

I guess with less coverage or poorer snow conditions, it becomes much more dangerous?
In my admittedly limited experience (two week-long trips, a year apart) if conditions are bad enough to be a problem, it's closed.
 

MattSmith

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The Cirque is a nice bucket list run to check off. I'll add a few quick points to the intel collected here.

The run out from Cirque and the named runs around the Cirque forms a natural half pipe. Depending on conditions this can be a lot of fun (with nice snow) or a single track bobsled run when conditions are firm. If you find more difficult conditions take your time and navigate the terrain. It's not steep. There aren't a lot of trees, but as the terrain narrows it can get a little sketchy.

My personal preference is the named "AMF" run to the skiers left of the Headwall proper. With a little side stepping you can make the AMF entrance from the Sheer Bliss lift. I may be corrected by some folks who measure slope angle, but I'd say AMF is a bit steeper than the Headwall. It's not a good place to fall in firm conditions. You probably won't bounce over rocks, but there's a good chance you'll slide to the bottom. Here's a shot from the top of AMF. February 13, 2019.
20190213_105314.jpg
The Cirque is out of view to the lookers right. You can see the gully / half pipe beginning to form to the left of the thick group of trees in the center of the picture.

I haven't skied the Cirque enough to know if a cornice forms at the top. I'm certain there's a cornice, but it's likely maintained enough for the drop in to be reasonable.

I much prefer the Hanging Valley area to the Cirque. It's not as visually stunning, but I think the lines and the snow through the trees are a lot of fun.

I plan to be in the area in early January with Ikon days to burn at Aspen. Hit me up if you are interested in meeting up.
 

mdf

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I think AMF is significantly more challenging than the route named "Cirque Headwall".
circque.PNG

Here's a clip from the 2016 joint EpicSki/Pugski Gathering (last of one, first of the other):

If I remember correctly, that is @Matchstix and @Unpiste loitering above the entrance. There are several other videos from this session on Youtube.

Edit to Add: I found the others. Includes @Near Nyquist too. You guys ski a lot better now.
 
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dbostedo

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I may be corrected by some folks who measure slope angle, but I'd say AMF is a bit steeper than the Headwall.

I think AMF is significantly more challenging than the route named "Cirque Headwall".

Well I can't let that go by without posting the Caltopo traces... AMF is well over 30 degrees for several hundred vertical feet. The headwall doesn't have a sustained pitch like that, but does have some steep shots too.

Cirque Headwall to where it meets AMF (~1000 vert. ft.):
upload_2019-10-29_15-31-49.png

AMF to where it meet Cirque Headwall (~600 vert. ft.):
upload_2019-10-29_15-56-19.png
 
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robert57

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@robert57 , what days will you be at Aspen? I will be skiing there January 12 - 15 and plan to hit 2 days at Snowmass, then a day each at Ajax and Highlands. I too am intrigued by the Cirque and Hanging Valley Glades as I've never ventured into those areas when at Snowmass. (Incidentally, you just referenced my Telluride video in the Telluride thread. It seems we have similar taste in ski areas.)

My ambitious goal for this January is to hit the Triple Crown of Aspen: Highland Bowl, the Cirque, and Hanging Valley. Hopefully, they will all be in good shape that early in the season.

Thanks to everyone for the useful information, very helpful. I will master free fall and westface first, I think I have skiied that area already but it was the year with limited snow (2017?) and the runs were large icy bumps. I dont think the poma was open at all when we were there that year.

Lofcaudio, I will be at Aspen on the course from 11 to 14 which leaves the window pretty tight but would love to meet up even if just to say hi. (PM me) My first taste of Snowmass was grabbing a bus from Aspen and joining a mountain guide tour, I met two great guys and we skiied a few more days together (or at least they put up with me). It included long shot which was knee deep the whole way down. Very fond memories.
 

Lofcaudio

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@robert57 , if @MattSmith is there the same time as you, I highly recommend you meet up with him. He's a great skier (makes everything look WAY too easy) and all around great guy (at least, best as I could tell). He also has some good familiarity with the Aspen mountains. I wish I would have let him talk me into making the Bowl hike a few years back. I still haven't done it.

Matt, what dates will you be skiing at Aspen? I'd love to give you another chance to sell me on Highland Bowl.
 

MattSmith

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^^
That's a super nice compliment @Lofcaudio. We sure had a blast at Aspen. I try my best to be a "good guy" and found my love of being on snow to be infectious. I just light up when I'm skiing or talking about skiing. Hard to believe it was 4 years ago. A lot has happened since then (including 2 additional trips up Highland).

I've moved to Minturn Colorado, so Aspen is just about 2 hours away (on dry roads). I'd love to use all 7 of my Ikon days, so I'm happy to make the trip over for a few ski days here and there. I see that you'll be there in early January. Hit me up as the dates grow close. Hopefully we can meet up and make some nice turns.

BTW - The POW is knee deep on Vail Mountain. It's setting up for a great snow season. This is from yesterday.
vail uphill.jpg
 

Mike King

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I thought I might tap the wisdom of the crowd about cirque headwall at Snowmass.

I'd really like to ski something off the top of the cirque poma but want a reality check and some advice on preparation. First some background, I am good, if slow, skier of a mature age who can ski black bumps runs with ease. I have not skied a lot of gladed areas. I will be back in Snowmass in Jan and have booked another 4 day bumps course at Aspen mountain.I have watched numerous youtube videos which don’t make this area look as steep as I suspect it might be, I assume its steep. I also appreciate the vagaries of the weather and snowpack limit the access to the area and would only attempt it on a clear day . I certainly don’t want to go in unprepared and am likely to be guided by friends who have skied the area before and tried to encourage me to join them.

So apart from the need for some sort of guide (friends or a pro) my questions for the first time up there are;

1. Is there a way down that is a good starting point to get a feel for the area?.

IMHO, the Cirque Headwall is the easiest line into the Cirque. You need to be comfortable with skiing crud as the area is ungroomed. Watch for rocks as you come to and through the lower gate off of the headwall.

If you want a bit steeper line, you should try the Ptarmigan entrance. Steeper than that? AMF, which stands for Adios my friend (or something analagous). Steeper? Gowdy's. Rowdier? Stilleto. More bumps? KT Gully. Cliffs to suck? Rock Island or the lines into the Burn Cliffs (if open).

2. What areas at snowmass should I be skiing comfortably before any attempt on the cirque? .

This is a great question and there are a variety of places to test your mettle before tackling the Cirque area. Personally, I'd start on Sam's knob. Ski Zugspitze which is a relatively steep bump run. As you approach the last bench, there is an opening to the skier's right between the aspens below and the spruce above -- drop through the opening and head downhill. You will come to a very short but quite steep slope that is known as the mini wall. It is about 3 turns long, but will give you an assessment of your ability to handle steep ungroomed slopes. We often use it as a test before we take folk into the Hanging Valley.

3. Is the exit through the trees at the bottom the tricky part?

The exit down through the gully gets to be quite steep and can be skied off to rocks, ice, and timber. There is a waterfall in the bottom of the gully that is not the most pleasant to ski. There are a couple of exits that I generally take. One is to come down the gully until you come to the intersection with KT gully. Start looking for a traverse on your left; this will take you into the lower part of Rock Island. This is an area with a few boulders, some usually nice bumps, and an exit that is more pleasant than going through the gully to the end.

Another, easier, exit is to ski to the top of the bench right under AMF. You should be able to follow a high traverse on your right that will deposit you onto Upper Green Cabin. If you feel ok with a few trees and a bit of a slope, you can ski through the trees just before you hit Upper Green Cabin. Realize that if you stay in too long, you will wind up in a steep section of relatively tight trees. They are fun, but can be skied down to some pointy rocks.

All suggestions or tips on preparing are welcomed.

Snowmass is a great area to take a lesson. There's a tremendous amount of terrain, and an instructor can help you find stuff you'd never find on your own. I've been going to Snowmass for over 15 years and have taught there for 5 and still there's areas I haven't skied...

Mike
 

mdf

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Ok, with all this discussion I now remember the long exit. There were some flattish sections with surprise! rocks sticking up.
 

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