Boot Fitting Failure

[rundmv]

Hey Guys,

Looking to level-set. I brought my tried and true alpine boots in for a slight punch on my sixth toe (five-year-old Rossignol Experience 120s) and the fitter took them in. A couple of days later they asked me to come in to sign a waiver which I didn't think much about, and two days after that they let me know that they'd punched through the boot. I was really mad and felt weird about the fact that they had me come in later to sign a waiver without seeing the boot.

I wen't in a little upset but willing to feel it out and they told me I was lucky the boot didn't break apart on the mountain and only in the shop (this didn't sit well). They fit me for a couple of boots and offered me 20% off last years version of a model I was not interested in, and for a model I was interested in they offered me a free binding adjustment (I too own a screw driver).

Is this standard practice? I would have sucked up a little toe pain if I thought there was a chance my boots would be destroyed. And I was hoping to keep these purpose built alpine boots for a while as I'm getting more into touring (getting close to 50/50) and wanted to get a pair of touring oriented boots end of season to have a nice two boot quiver.

Thanks Guys. Curious to know what you all think.

 

[Philpug]

A punch does not take days. Sorry, this does not cut it. What exactly did the waiver say..and protect the shop from? As a fitter, if I ruin a boot, I bought a boot.

 

[Analisa]

Terrible service. I bought a pair of Mach 1 Pro LVs last year from Evo (and got them price matched down to ~$425 within a week). A fitter didn't realize the cuff shell plastic was different from more popular models of the Mach1 line and when he tapped his finger on it to see if it had softened, he put a pretty impressive dent in it - but just cosmetic. Evo offered to replace it, but I opted for custom footbeds instead since it felt wasteful. Their head fitter still contacted me afterwards that he was intent on replacing it since he didn't like sending work out of the shop like that. This year, he special ordered the Pro LVs for me, and when they ended up being too stiff with the new cuff height & modifications, he ordered a 105 LV that they don't even carry on-site or in store.

When I asked for the softer model, my fitter was even like "you know, you could sell the stiffer ones on eBay for just under MSRP, buy the 105s and pocket the difference, right?" And that's the service from a big box store.

 

[Jwrags]

I know nothing about boot fitting but it is obvious that they had you sign the waiver after they screwed up your boot. Time for a conversation with the manager or owner if the shop is small enough to have one locally.

 

[eok]

Wow. I see the fitter's handling of things as being particularly deceptive. In my book "deceptive" = "dishonest".

On top of that, the best they could do is offer you 20% off on a new but older model boot - of their choice. Sheesh. This is just plain abusive. At the very least: they should have fitted you to the best boot for you - regardless of model year - and given you a much deeper discount (60%-70% off) and free fitting work. Some shops would completely own the screw-up & just give you new boots for free.

They deserve a complaint to the Better Business Bureau and an awful review on Yelp.

 

[James]

With the “waiver”, esp after you came in, this is next level sleazy.

 

[pliny the elder]

Everyone makes mistakes, it's how you handle it that makes the difference.

Its up to the shop in question to square things with you in a way that's fair to everyone, but the waiver?
We don't ask for a waiver when we cant and lift boots.

Integrity, is a lot like virginity, it's easier to lose than to regain.

pliny the elder

 

[graham418]

Definitely time to find a new shop. I have never heard of signing a waiver. Especially after the fact . I would talk to the owner. Demand satisfaction!

 

[tube77]

That's not what other shops do.
Last season, my local shop over ground my ski base that resulted in waves on the base near the tip.
They admitted their fault and took a full responsibility. The offered me new skis with a similar spec.
A bit of drama but happy ending.

In you case, it's the same thing.
They screwed up your boots by their poor workmanship so they must take full responsibility by offering you new boots not by offering you shitty 20% discount. (Usually shops are selling last season's boots at the 50% and more discounted price.)
Also I never heard any waiver form for the tuning shop. Is it even legal?
I would report to BBB, yelp, facebook, or local new papers wherever you can.

 

[Philpug]

I will then say, irrelevant on the mistake that happened. The OP has a 5-6 year old boot that now needs a punch? Sorry, it is time for a new boot anyway, you need a punch now because the liner is packed out and your foot is now moving around. But the choice if getting a new boot should be yours and not thrust upon you by a shops mistake.

They deserve a complaint to the Better Business Bureau and an awful review on Yelp.

I would report to BBB, yelp, facebook, or local new papers wherever you can.

Before we get out the pitch forks and torches, let's give the shop a chance to rectify the mistake. Hopefully they will make the customer happy by either replacing the boot with a comparable one of his choice or fixing the one they punched through (with some sort of store credit). Is there still a BBB? Local news paper? C'mon, no one reads them any more. . I would say Yelp and sites like this will be the best way to get their attention.

 

[tube77]

I will then say, irrelevant on the mistake that happened. The OP has a 5-6 year old boot that now needs a punch? Sorry, it is time for a new boot anyway, you need a punch now because the liner is packed out and your foot is now moving around. But the choice if getting a new boot should be yours and not thrust upon you by a shops mistake.



Before we get out the pitch forks and torches, let's give the shop a chance to rectify the mistake. Hopefully they will make the customer happy by either replacing the boot with a comparable one of his choice or fixing the one they punched through (with some sort of store credit). Is there still a BBB? Local news paper? C'mon, no one reads them any more. . I would say Yelp and sites like this will be the best way to get their attention.

Oh.. I completely missed this part .. "five-year-old Rossignol Experience 120s"
I never imagined myself bringing my five year old boots to the shop as it's already well fitted when I first bought it..

I agree with you. It's time for him to buy new pair of boots.
It wouldn't be surprised if the 5 years old boots by itself break apart while skiing if it's been poorly stored during the summer or it's been more than 30/50 days per year for the past 5 years.
So it's quite possible that something goes wrong while punching/grinding the five years old boots.

I would probably ask the shop if they can offer like $100~$150 store credit at best..

 

[Philpug]

Oh.. I completely missed this part .. "five-year-old Rossignol Experience 120s"
I never imagined myself bringing my five year old boots to the shop as it's already well fitted when I first bought it..

I agree with you. It's time for him to buy new pair of boots.
It wouldn't be surprised if the 5 years old boots by itself break apart while skiing if it's been poorly stored during the summer or it's been more than 30/50 days per year for the past 5 years.
So it's quite possible that something goes wrong while punching/grinding the five years old boots.

I would probably ask the shop if they can offer like $100~$150 store credit at best..

5 year old plastics are a lot different than the 15-30 year old plastics that do tend to break down and break. That was not the issue. You really have to go out of your way to go through a shell with a punch..unless the boot was on an UltraCam and the temp was set too high. I did that to a Tecnica Bushwacker years ago but that was Pebex, I melted a perfect circle through the shell at the ankle. The Rossi Experience 120 shell is a traditional plastic, nearly indestructible. IIRC, it is also a transucent shell, so even grinding the shell, you can see what you are doing inside.

Replace the boots for free? Yes, that is a definite possibility and if presented properly would have made a loyal customer for sure. Minimally, a pro-rated discount towards a new boot, half price at a minimum should have been offered. But as @pliny the elder posted, it's how you handle the situation makes all the difference and having the customer sign the waiver days after the boot was brought in raises the red integrity flag to full mast.

 

[Tom K.]

Well, feet can change in five years. I've got small, outer, mid-foot "bumps" that weren't there five years ago.

Aging is often unpleasant!

 

[Erik Timmerman]

Well, feet can change in five years. I've got small, outer, mid-foot "bumps" that weren't there five years ago.

Aging is often unpleasant!

Also, we don't know how much he skis. Maybe these boots have only 40 days on them. Further, it has been my experience that boots will sometimes un-punch themselves over time. I've definitely gone back for re-punches on well-loved boots.

 

[Andy Mink]

My biggest concern is, if there is a waiver required, it should be signed up front just like any other waiver. Did they forget to give it to the OP? Or did they really punch a hole then have the waiver signed? Age or condition of boots aside, this seems like it was a little sneaky. Definitely time to move it up the ladder to manager/owner.

 

[rundmv]

Thanks for the responses guys. I wen't in again to talk with the fitters and they explained that "they didn't break my boot, my boot broke". Other than that lack of admission they were generally good guys and their offer was 20% off this years model that I was interested in.

I can see it both ways, as they explained the waiver is really only when they suspect a high probability of breakage (this really wasn't conveyed to me as such) but it's still a huge bummer and if I'd known there was even a 20% chance of breakage I wouldn't have done it.

I did send them a link to this thread so hopefully it doesn't happen again and we've all learned from it.

Will I return to said shop? 50/50 but I may make them sign a waiver...

 

[rundmv]

A punch does not take days. Sorry, this does not cut it. What exactly did the waiver say..and protect the shop from? As a fitter, if I ruin a boot, I bought a boot.

Thanks for the reply. As a common dummy I didn't take the time to read the waiver but since talking to them they supposedly only ask folks to come sign the waiver if the chance of breakage is high (didn't feel like this was appropriately communicated).

They seemed like good guys and got me into a pair of boots i liked for 20% off but I'll see if maybe they can help me out a little more down the line as it sounds like this isn't common practice and I got the same response as yours when talking to a different local fitter in person.

I shared the thread with them at least.

 

[Philpug]

Thanks for the responses guys. I wen't in again to talk with the fitters and they explained that "they didn't break my boot, my boot broke". Other than that lack of admission they were generally good guys and their offer was 20% off this years model that I was interested in.

I can see it both ways, as they explained the waiver is really only when they suspect a high probability of breakage (this really wasn't conveyed to me as such) but it's still a huge bummer and if I'd known there was even a 20% chance of breakage I wouldn't have done it.

I did send them a link to this thread so hopefully it doesn't happen again and we've all learned from it.

Will I return to said shop? 50/50 but I may make them sign a waiver...

Did they give you your old boot back...did they even show it to you? Could you post pics of where it "just broke". I am sorry but this still does not pass the sniff test. I am not one for calling out a shop but again, this is just not adding up. I agree with you wanting them to sign a waiver next time.

 

[Core2]

Do modern boots (last 10 years) even have the possibility of cracking on the slopes? Lame excuse imo.

 

[Funkendrenchman]

20% off this year's model is a pretty lame offer. That same boot will be 40% off by the end of next month.