Birds of Prey 2018 Nov. 30 - Dec. 2, 2018

[Tom Holtmann]

Is MMA really popular because of its stars? I doubt it but don't follow it. I suspect they're just a cherry on top.

Nascar at onetime was taking everything over with marketing but has fallen back majorly.

At the moment Connor MacGregor is one of the most famous athletes in the world ( I don't follow much either but I know who he is). I think maybe a better example would be Tiger Woods and Golf.

 

[Blue Streak]

FYI
There's a new schedule.
https://www.vaildaily.com/news/sports/snow-at-beaver-creek-shuffles-birds-of-prey-racing-schedule/

 

[Primoz]

Just got msg from FIS it's plan B, which means start of DH is moved down to Brink, with start of first racer at 10:45. So happy I don't need to be on course

 

[Tricia]

FYI
There's a new schedule.
https://www.vaildaily.com/news/sports/snow-at-beaver-creek-shuffles-birds-of-prey-racing-schedule/

Welcome to the "irony can be ironic" edition of the Birds of Prey.

 

[4ster]

Not your usual birds of prey but glad they got the race off.

Sad to see Dressen carted off.




Good skiing from Americans Bennet & Nyman.

 

[dbostedo]

Good skiing from Americans Bennet & Nyman.

Agreed... and they tied each other!

Upsetting to see Dressen hurt and know he was really hurt by his reactions. Appears he ripped up a knee and dislocated a shoulder - done for the season.

 

[Tricia]

Not your usual birds of prey but glad they got the race off.

Sad to see Dressen carted off.




Good skiing from Americans Bennet & Nyman.

Watching the replay this morning.
Wow, Nyman!
Not harassing on Bennet, but Nyman is coming off a very disappointing year and just amazed me on his run.

For anyone who's interested, here is an article in Denver Post about Bennet and Nyman.

 

[Teppaz]

The Dressen crash was awful. I had to mute it out, his cries were a gut punch. And then you see Urs Kryenbühl of Switzerland doing an eggbeater yesterday, crashing into the net, and then skiing down. I don't even know how that was possible.

 

[dbostedo]

The Dressen crash was awful. I had to mute it out, his cries were a gut punch. And then you see Urs Kryenbühl of Switzerland doing an eggbeater yesterday, crashing into the net, and then skiing down. I don't even know how that was possible.

I'm thinking Dressen's knee went the instant he started to crash... the way the ski wobbled and hooked before he went down could have done it. Knees are strange... some people are hurt and in pain, others ski through it and only realize later they hurt something.

I had a friend blow his ACL playing soccer and walk off the field. He only went to the doctor the next day because it felt weird and unstable.

And yeah, Kryenbuhl's looked bad... glad he was OK.

 

[Average Joe]

Nice day for the US Men’s team. 4 guys in the flip, Ligety a solid 8th, Tommy Ford 15th, Brian McLaughlin 18th (maybe Tiger Shaw might consider him good enough to be a US Ski Team member now?) and RCS In 22nd.

 

[Muleski]

Agree, good day. Not a great day. We'll see how much Ligety can contend, and where he realistically stands in this field as the season moves on, and the WC moves to Europe. Ted is about as healthy as he has been in recent years. If he can make some gains in his training, perhaps we'll see a podium. That may be too much of an ask. Hope not.

Tommy Ford is "what he is". He's not a kid. He has been at this for a LONG time now. He is now pretty much a GS specialist. He is a lean guy and doesn't carry much body mass. He's also had a lot of nagging injury issues, particularly his back. I think that Tommy at his best can break into the top 10 frequently, with the right set of circumstances, and we should applaud that skiing. He can't ski with the top of the field.

RCS is really skiing well, in three events. He had injury problems for a couple of years, was healthy last year and seems to be skiing with a lot of consistency and speed. I assume that he was not happy, whatsoever, with today's 22nd. His expectations are now much, much higher, which is great.

BMac....the guy is absolutely for real. He's smart, he's athletic, he's strong, and he brings it. I was delighted to see how he skied and managed himself today. Really smart. And yes, he may be "Example A" in how stupid the USST criteria is. I don't think there is a single person in the sport who did not think that the USST should have broken with protocol and made him a discretionary pick. Why hold back one of our top hunger talents? At 25, he did not have a top 30 WR....because he had largely raced a college and NorAm schedule, which he dominated. I hope this buries any discussion as to whether his 6 point GS profile is "legit." He has been receiving some great coaching with Peter Lange, of Team America. Funded by Dan Leever. I would really like to see Jessie Hunt and Tiger break all of the ancient "rules" and name him to the team...NOW. Of course, the USST has a long standing rule of no midseason changes. So stupid. But for a reality check, Brian is older than HK, and Loic Meillard, just a year younger than Luitz. His trajectory is high, though, IMO.

"The future of the US Ski Team", River Radamus, is only 20. He and Luke Winters have a very bright future. No need to get hung up on their results today. Luke is only 21, BTW. Kyle Negomir is a local kid, new to the USST, so good spot for his first WC start. He will be looked at as more of a speed skier.

Surprised that we did not start Sam Morse in the DH or SG. Very solid young talent. Could have been anything.....including feeling under the weather. Have not heard. The kid is the absolute real deal. Won World Juniors DH two seasons ago, which is generally a good indicator of the future.

Solid day, though Ted, Tommy and RCS are probably not pleased. I bet Brian is.

Great skiing by Luitz. GREAT. First race back from his ACL surgery. Hirscher went after it, full gas, and came in second. That was impressive. The European guys do not tend to ease back into it after injury. Just get right into it.

OBVIOUSLY, THE most amazing performance was Tumler. Bib 48 skiing onto the podium. Wow! That's incredible. That 3 point result will help his start position.....quite a bit. Great, great day!

Nice day for Ms. Shiffrin. Another milestone. Wow.

 

[4ster]

Nice day for Ms. Shiffrin. Another milestone. Wow.

Crushed it!

 

[Primoz]

Agree, good day. Not a great day. We'll see how much Ligety can contend, and where he realistically stands in this field as the season moves on, and the WC moves to Europe. Ted is about as healthy as he has been in recent years. If he can make some gains in his training, perhaps we'll see a podium.

I admit I saw just first run, as I had better things to do after that (after shooting biathlon WC all day long I finally have some time to do sport myself and I went to play ice hockey ), but from what I saw in first run, I would say p8 is actually great result considering the skiing I saw from him in first run. Sure, 1 run and even that in everything but perfect conditions is not something you can draw much conclusions out of it, but GS moved on, and I have feeling this time Ligety is not the one that is leading the pack (in technique and material). Technique of today's GS changed, while for me, Ligety is still skiing pretty much the same as he did when 35m skis came out first year, and I don't think that's still fast. So if there will be podium, at least on what I saw yesterday, it will be huge surprise, but otherwise I would say every top 10 result will be great result for him.

 

[Bolder]

The SG was a great race. Tumler...I think he benefited hugely from faster snow lower down, but still...also great snow in Colorado.

 

[K2 Rat]

I have never heard of the no oxygen rule ( if it is a rule ), but have never seen an athlete taking oxygen either.

 

[Muleski]

At the FIS Congress two years ago they banned the supplemental use of oxygen at all WC events. I think the primary focus was Nordic, but it applies to Alpine. And as I understand it, it’s not just before racing, between runs, at the start. I have no idea how they monitor, etc.

WADA obviously does not list oxygen as a banned PED. It sounds like the Germans are saying they were unaware of the oxygen rule, and are completely aware of the WADA lists and protocol. Hmmm......

Sorry to see Luitz in this position. Presume he gets DQ’d. Too bad. Victory to Hirscher. My guess, anyways.

 

[Primoz]

I'm not sure about this either, but I heard some rumors, this FIS rule applies only to Olympics, which is kinda weird, if true, as Olympics are pretty much only place, where FIS actually doesn't have much, if any at all, jurisdiction. But in rule it should be that no oxygen tanks are allowed on venue, so this goes for before race (goes for time when teams arrive to venue, normally about 2 days before actual start), during race and after race. You can't prove anything with doping test, so it's quite hard to monitor this kind of rule. Also, just out of head, so might be wrong, as my memory is sort of selective, use of oxygen was on WADA prohibited list, but was removed few years ago, while it stayed on FIS list. On "doping list" are not only medicines, but also procedures, so it's perfectly fine. And "not knowing certain rule" doesn't make it ok, so excuse of "being unaware of FIS rule" is BS.

 

[skix]

And "not knowing certain rule" doesn't make it ok, so excuse of "being unaware of FIS rule" is BS.

Did they take the oxygen out in the open or did they hide their usage? Always doing it unobserved would indicate they knew it was not approved and didn't want authorities or other competitors to know. If they were truly unaware of the rule you'd expect to see an athlete using the oxygen and you'd expect to see the tanks and other gear. If all that's hidden then their unaware excuse is BS.

 

[dbostedo]

Did they take the oxygen out in the open or did they hide their usage? Always doing it unobserved would indicate they knew it was not approved and didn't want authorities or other competitors to know. If they were truly unaware of the rule you'd expect to see an athlete using the oxygen and you'd expect to see the tanks and other gear. If all that's hidden then their unaware excuse is BS.

Eh, not quite that easy... they could claim they did it in a secretive way because they didn't want other ski teams to know how much or how often or what timing they used with their oxygen, and they assumed all the other teams were doing the same.

 

[Muleski]

Here's how the decision and vote was described right after voting. This was decided at the 2016-2017 FIS Congress held in Cancun, Mexico. I am sure that a perusal of the rule book will detail it.

"With relation to anti-doping rules, the use of use oxygen tanks, hypoxic chambers and cryogenic chambers or similar medical equipment is now prohibited during FIS World Championships, World Cups and other competitions registered in the FIS calendar."

I believe that it was further communicated that it meant anywhere during the event calendar. Not just not the hill, in the athlete's lounge, etc. No supplemental oxygen. Period. ANY event on the FIS calendar.

Now, as others have said, and as I mentioned in an earlier post, I have no idea how they test or monitor this. Nor am I going to dig into any confusion between WADA, FIS and the IOC.....

I'd hate to be the oxygen police trying to catch the cheaters. I believe that those around Luitz were not aware of this, if in fact others were observing it. Particularly in the day when everybody has a video cam built into their phone.