Any experience with Stio or Mountain Hardwear?

[bremmick]

Looking to get a new kit. I believe I’ve narrowed down, but haven’t utilized either of these brands before. My latest kit Flylow Higgins jacket and Baker bib was pretty good. Face fabric pulled quick. Bibs lost their waterproofing quick.

Stio Environ Jacket and Bib - Derzimax Fabric

Mountain Hardwear Cloud Bank Bib and Jacket - Goretex 2 layer

Any experience with these fabrics and/or kits? Looking for waterproof and breathable. As well as durability. Mostly resort skiing and a lot of it. Usually 50 days a season.
Thanks.

 

[BC.]

Ask @Ron.....he’s got the info on Stio ....I bought an Environ jacket off him, and just got Environ pants too based on his knowledge.

 

[AmyPJ]

Paging @Analisa

 

[Ron]

love stio stuff, 3 layer, bomber construction, quality manufacturing. I just wrote a review on the pants which will come out soon. Just ask away .

dermiziz is 20K h20 proof, 10K breathability and has a really good quality DWR finish.

 

[Analisa]

I have some experience with Dermizax with Orage and was really surprised how well it breathes for a PU membrane. The Stio stuff's a pretty decent value. It's not the most breathable/waterproof membrane. 150D polyester plain weave isn't the most durable, or the heaviest, or the best or least breathable fabrics. But it's a really solid all-around scorer.

Mountain Hardwear's stuff is hard to read. They don't share much other than polyester fabric, and they've got some messy item data. (All sites say their shell jacket has 60g/40g body mapped insulation). They're using Gore Stretch panels, which were previously only available to Arc'teryx & OR, but they're able to beat the $600 price point by skipping the 3L construction (it'll have a sewn in lining) and swapping polyester for nylon. Based on the fabric weight, it's a little lighter than the Environ.

They're pretty different options, but if you value:
Overall weight: MHW
Breathe: MHW, probably
Fabric Durability: Stio
Waterproof membrane durability: Stio
Stretch: MHW
Waterpoof membrane performance: MHW, but again slight

 

[skibum4ever]

I am using a new pair of Mountain Hardware bibs and I really like them. They are warm, comfortable, and boast a Recco device. They seem true to size

Best of all, their petite bibs fit me without shortening. That is a rarity for me.

 

[François Pugh]

I've had a Mountain Hardware jacket for about five years. Dry Q Elite and Thermal Q Elite. Breathable and waterproof, 40,000, 40,000 rating IIRC. I'm pretty happy with it.

 

[Tricia]

I have some experience with Dermizax with Orage and was really surprised how well it breathes for a PU membrane.

Me too!
I often get a question about "what's the most waterproof?" or "Do you have Gore-tex?" But there are some other options that have blown my mind in quality and breathability that are not in the regular conversation.
I'm currently wearing some Helly Hansen HellyTech Professional stuff that is crazy good.
In the past I've had a stuff that is Dermizax and love how it stretches and stays waterproof.

 

[Bruuuce]

I'm wearing the Environ jacket this year. 15 days on it and so far it's the best jacket I've owned. The fit is very good, the fabric seems durable and the waterproofing and breathability seem excellent. I'll let Ron speak to the construction details. I'll just say that I'm really picky about jackets and this one has delivered.

 

[EricG]

Mountain hardware is different now that it’s under the Columbia umbrella. The quality does not appear to be what it used to be..

 

[Alexzn]

I’d wait for some user reviews on the new NorthFace Futurelight kits. Supposed to be an optimized version of NeoShell done in house. Early reviews are intriguing. I can tell you that my favorite resort jacket remains my old first generation FlyLow LabCoat 1.0. Stretch, breathable and still waterproof. Sadly, the DWR is all lost, so I try to use it mostly on sunny days to preserve the DWR on my Arcteryx.

 

[Ron]

Stio Environ Jacket Review

I picked up the Stio Environ last season while looking for the “perfect” Colorado ski jacket. I have 30+ days in it while skiing a different brand for comparison. Based in Jackson, WY, Stio has clearly designed a jacket for skiers, by skiers. The shell is made from Dermizax, a durable...

www.pugski.com

I have a review sitting in the bullpen on the Environ Pants but my Review from last season on the environ jacket is here. In total, I have to have close to a 100 days in them and have never once had moisture go through the DWR and its been totally windproof. As I state, the 10K breathability is fine with me. the jacket has pit zips and keep me warm on really cold days where jackets with ultra breathable fabrics can let too much warmth escape. Beyond the basics, the Stio Environs are manufactured extremely well. all seams are taped and the quality is exceptional. I love the pocket placement and the double zippers. Durability has been excellent. with many jackets now hitting 500-700, this is a really solid value

 

[pchewn]

I live a couple of blocks from Columbia Sportswear headquarters in Beaverton. Their "employee store" is periodically open to non-employees. I bought a nice pair of Mountain Hardware ski pants there. I ski on wet snow (Mt Hood), in the rain, and the lift attendants never wipe the snow off of the chairs. The Mountain Hardware pants keep me dry and warm (un-insulated). They have lasted well for 2 seasons (120 ski days). While I have 2 jackets, I only have 1 pair of ski pants and I'm happy with them.

@Ron reports that his jacket is dry. But he's in Steamboat. The real test of skiwear dryness is skiing in rain. I don't think Steamboat has much rain skiing......

 

[Ron]

I don't ski in the rain.

 

[Bruuuce]

I'd agree that it might not be my jacket for the PNW, but luckily I live where it doesn't rain much in the winter. The last couple of days here have been warm and wet though and it has performed well.

 

[Noodler]

I have been really impressed by the Dermizax 20K/20K in my higher-end Descente jackets. Stio has good bang-for-the-buck. Mountain Hardwear isn't what it once was before it was swallowed up by Columbia.

 

[Ron]

BTW- Stio now has the Raymer line which is targeted at the AT crowd or those who want a lightweight setup that features Toray 3Layer Entrant fabric.

ENTRANT™ 3L Waterproof/ Breathable, 100% Nylon, ENTRANT™ Microporous Membrane, 20,000mm waterproofness, 13,000 g/m2/24hrs breathability, 50 denier, 140 g/m2, 80/20 DWR
Toray™ Entrant™ is a lightweight 50-denier waterproof/breathable plainweave fabric that offers durability, a soft hand and mechanical stretch. With a 20,000 mm waterproof, 13,000 g/m2 breathability and hydrophobic microporous membrane, it provides quick response to weather related changes and an ideal balance between waterproofness and moisture permeability.

 

[bremmick]

I’m wondering how different the Raymer is breathability wise. That jacket is getting solid praise for that. Wondering if Environ is near that or a long ways off in actual use.

 

[Ron]

The Raymer is 13K breathability vs the Environ 10K. the Raymer is out and available here. https://www.stio.com/products/mens-raymer-jacket?variant=30084998594625


the reality is unless you are willing to pony up the bucks for a 20k/20K jacket that is well-made the Stio stuff is really hard to beat.

 

[bremmick]

The Raymer is 13K breathability vs the Environ 10K. the Raymer is out and available here. https://www.stio.com/products/mens-raymer-jacket?variant=30084998594625


the reality is unless you are willing to pony up the bucks for a 20k/20K jacket that is well-made the Stio stuff is really hard to beat.

I could pony up. Especially with the pro deals I’m able to get through a tone of volunteer coaching I do. What’s your favorites out there?