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Erik Timmerman

So much better than a pro
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This is the danger of Tesla calling their driving aids "Autopilot" and making a huge deal about it, then telling people quietly "but you still have to pay attention..:" *nudge nudge* When you are told it's Autopilot, and you can drive some ways without paying attention, what makes anyone think people will actually pay attention?? I do not understand how this is allowed to happen.

Well it's Elon Musk, so it's OK. If GM was doing what Tesla is doing, there'd be billions of dollars of fines. Well, maybe not GM, but VW or Toyota would pay for sure!
 

cantunamunch

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Well it's Elon Musk, so it's OK. If GM was doing what Tesla is doing, there'd be billions of dollars of fines. Well, maybe not GM,

When you wrote this, did you know Cadillac has infrared attention detectors (several per cabin) to keep the driver honest during automated lane keeping?

And then who pays! :huh: Tough putting software engineers in jail..

Who pays is not a mystery - witness Boeing paying for the software mistake on the 737 MAX 8.

There is very little cars will do software-wise that airplanes won't have done first. And guess what - we already have procedural frameworks for dealing with incidents arising from automation.
 
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James

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I’m not convinced. Investigations after the crash are comprehensive, but is as much effort in place before? There seems to be a lack of rigorous review before some of these software designs are implemented. In airplanes.

Cars are a mess. Does anyone look at them?Go back to the Toyota acceleration issue of several years ago. That software was pretty bad once it was pulled apart. The software used in cars is so proprietary that the guy who was granted permission to study it was locked in a room everyday for a month, no phone, no contact.

Witness the Boeing Mcas system and the earlier Airbus issues. The Mcas Boeing changed the implementation, and it just sort of skated through approval as it had already been looked at.
The very first civilian fly by wire aircraft, the Airbus A-320, crashed on a passenger carrying airshow demo in 1988. The pilot has always claimed the computer locked him out of increasing power.

Then there’s Air France flight 447, an Airbus A-330 flying Rio to Paris that disappeared over the ocean in 2009. No Mayday. It’s a complex issue of computer control, changing rules for joystick input, copilot not aware of the current input rule, and the design issue of the copilot’s control input not duplicated on the pilot’s. At one point they were both doing opposite things - pilot trying to get the nose down, copilot going up. Three and a half minutes down from 38,000 ft.
 

jmeb

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Warning to others -- the video in that link shows someone dying.

This is why we need to stop allowing people with cars off so easy. This is why we need to stop subsidizing private car driving. This is why we need to stop putting 95% of transportation funding into just roads.

That person is dead whether they were on a bike, with or without a helmet, or they were walking down the street, or they were in small car, etc etc etc.

We need to build cities for people. Not multi-thousand-pound automobiles that spend most of their life just sitting around.
 

Alba Adventures

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Warning to others -- the video in that link shows someone dying.

This is why we need to stop allowing people with cars off so easy. This is why we need to stop subsidizing private car driving. This is why we need to stop putting 95% of transportation funding into just roads.

That person is dead whether they were on a bike, with or without a helmet, or they were walking down the street, or they were in small car, etc etc etc.

We need to build cities for people. Not multi-thousand-pound automobiles that spend most of their life just sitting around.


I can't say we were friends, though did know him and he was a great guy. Ironically, a friend of mine 2 years ago nearly died from a distracted driver. An accomplished athlete and was making a decision to ride more gravel as opposed to the roads of LA where she relocated to for work. Sadly, a distracted driver, looking at her phone and blinded by supposedly the sun setting struck and nearly killed Edie Perkins. She survived, though paralyzed and through her will power and sheer outlook in life, is still a competitor.

Another friend of mine, a former teammate was hit from behind in Colorado just a couple of weeks ago. Some here probably saw the news - hit and run, left for dead. This is the latest update on my friend - hoping they find the driver that did this to him.

https://www.bicycling.com/news/a28511093/andrew-bernstein-hit-and-run-crash/

Our kids, though ski more than ride, me, the dad grew up bicycle racing since the age of 5 to 44.
 

jmeb

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The kid is charged with multiple felonies. What are you looking for?

If you read any coverage at all about it you'll quickly find that the fact the driver is charged with multiple felonies is notable for how uncommon that charge for drivers who kill cyclists are.

It's great that the DA chose to do so in this instance. But it is rare.
 
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crgildart

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I almost pulled out in front of a bike today. Looked right and saw nothing, looked left and saw nothing, looked back to the right as I started to pull out and there was a bike coming at a pretty good clip right on top of me. Slammed on my brakes before I impeded them, but man, I can't believe I didn't see them the first time I looked right. They had that OH SH!t look of impending doom when they saw me starting to pull out then smiled when they knew I saw them just in time..
 

Jenny

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1A on NPR is going to have a show about cyclists and motorists on Monday. They were soliciting stories and such today.
 

Rich McP

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This is the danger of Tesla calling their driving aids "Autopilot" and making a huge deal about it, then telling people quietly "but you still have to pay attention..:" *nudge nudge* When you are told it's Autopilot, and you can drive some ways without paying attention, what makes anyone think people will actually pay attention?? I do not understand how this is allowed to happen.
My understanding is that there are shield laws on the books to protect automakers against certain lawsuits regarding self driving car failures. All in the name of facilitating development of self driving cars. it's my belief that development of these systems will go better with the companies and the CEOs on the hook for huge claims. They CAN do this development in a "safe" way if they are motivated to do so.
 

James

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In it's early days the fly-by-wire F-16 was known as "The lawn dart".
It's inherently unstable and can only fly with the computer. That made it highly maneuverable. Plus early 1960's simulators- which didn't and designing response of the stick.
Good article that has one angle on the development of the plane. Didn't know it was called the Viper originally and it was something of a cowboy operation. The Air Force only wanted more of their F-15's.
------------------
Air Force Systems Command test pilots and Tactical Air Command pilots flew the YF-16 and YF-17. By all accounts, the -16’s performance was phenomenal, but the aircraft had inherited a major problem from the F-15: the F100 engine. Installed on the F-16, it had an alarming habit of refusing to provide more than idle thrust at the worst possible moments.

On their first flights, Ettinger and retired Colonel Dean Stickell both experienced engine “rollbacks”; Ettinger didn’t even make it out of the chocks, but Stickell’s rollback occurred shortly after takeoff. Fortunately, he was at 15,000 feet and right over the runway at Edwards. The engine was also prone to compressor stalls, a phenomenon that can produce spectacular flames out both ends of the engine, with explosions violent enough to knock a pilot’s feet off the rudder pedals. Until the engine problem was fixed, the YF-16 had to stay within deadstick landing distance of the base.
--------------https://www.airspacemag.com/military-aviation/outrageous-adolescence-f-16-180949491/#6XIYGrS5MPqeltI3.99

I love how "shortly after takeoff" = 15k ft.
 

luliski

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Looks like the cyclist can get it done all by themselves.

https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2019/08/26/cyclist-pedestrian-collision-central-park/

People have to accept responsibility for their own actions.
They don't say whether the pedestrian walked in front of the cyclist. I know someone here in town who suffered a severe tib-fib fracture when he made an avoidance maneuver on his bike to avoid hitting students who crossed the street without looking after getting off the bus.
 

KingGrump

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They don't say whether the pedestrian walked in front of the cyclist. I know someone here in town who suffered a severe tib-fib fracture when he made an avoidance maneuver on his bike to avoid hitting students who crossed the street without looking after getting off the bus.

My focus is not on the initial pedestrian/cyclist incident but the litany of observed cyclist mishaps afterward by the reporter. Sometimes I think the cyclist in NYC has more genetic affinity to the dodo bird than most people is willing to acknowledge.
 

jmeb

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The dodo bird died out.

Cycling is going to get bigger and bigger in US cities. Whether grumpy people want it to or not.

It's the car that should die out in cities. In NYC alone drivers killed over 120 non-car drivers last year. Cyclists killed 2.
 

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