Ankle Tendons/Ligaments -- Ouch!

[Tom K.]

Kind of embarrassing to admit, but after 42 days of pulling off my Raptors in the parking lot, I've really pulled some tendons/ligaments on the outside of my ankle, right below the "knob".

Slowly improving, but I'm on a 7 day ski trip, and it's tough to rest. Any remedial ideas would be appreciated.

TIA!

 

[Andy Mink]

Kind of embarrassing to admit, but after 42 days of pulling off my Raptors in the parking lot, I've really pulled some tendons/ligaments on the outside of my ankle, right below the "knob".

Slowly improving, but I'm on a 7 day ski trip, and it's tough to rest. Any remedial ideas would be appreciated.

TIA!

Ice and ibuprofen. Take the time to warm them up, either in the car or lodge. They are a b*%ch to get off when cold. I pull the tongue pretty hard to the inside, push my hand down the inside of the back and pull. Foot comes out about half way, then I whack the heel on the ground and it pops off.

 

[Coach13]

^^^What Andy said plus Biofreeze. BioFreeze and BodyGlide are always within easy access for me be it skiing or golf.

 

[Tom K.]

Thanks, guys. I've been doing the usual ankle stuff of NSAIDs, ice, gentle massage, tracing the alphabet gently in the air with big toe.

My brain knows that plus time will be the trick, but my heart really wants a quick "miracle" solution.

Slow and steady, I guess......

 

[Jenny]

FYI - That's part of the area that I had repaired last year (peroneal tendon split, superior retinaculum repair, plus some other stuff) and the doctor told me not to take ibuprofen as it inhibits tendon recovery. So, maybe another NSAID? I don't know if it was only due to the surgery, and had it just been soreness/inflammation it would have been OK, but . . .

 

[Tom K.]

FYI - That's part of the area that I had repaired last year (peroneal tendon split, superior retinaculum repair, plus some other stuff) and the doctor told me not to take ibuprofen as it inhibits tendon recovery. So, maybe another NSAID? I don't know if it was only due to the surgery, and had it just been soreness/inflammation it would have been OK, but . . .

Interesting. I've been using Aleve, but not sure whether that's really any different from ibuprofen in this regard.

Also tried some Voltaren gel said a Canadian Connection recommended. No noticeable effect.

Another friend recommended DMSO, but not sure I want to go there!

I hope you healed up well, and I hope mine isn't that bad.

 

[Coach13]

Ankles can take a long time to heal and sometimes the weakness and pain of an ankle injury can linger on for a long time. By a long time I mean years.

 

[neonorchid]

FYI - That's part of the area that I had repaired last year (peroneal tendon split, superior retinaculum repair, plus some other stuff) and the doctor told me not to take ibuprofen as it inhibits tendon recovery. So, maybe another NSAID? I don't know if it was only due to the surgery, and had it just been soreness/inflammation it would have been OK, but . . .

Correct.

Interesting. I've been using Aleve, but not sure whether that's really any different from ibuprofen in this regard.

Also tried some Voltaren gel said a Canadian Connection recommended. No noticeable effect.

Another friend recommended DMSO, but not sure I want to go there!

I hope you healed up well, and I hope mine isn't that bad.

No NSAID means NO NSAID's! Tendons need the inflamation to trigger the healing response, all NSAID's will inhibit that.

Use Ice.

My 2¢, Stop taking the boots off when cold and inflexible. The more you keep aggravating it, the longer it'll take to heal, and could get worse. (been there done that wrt speed skates and ended up with a nasty case peroneal tendonitis).

Also, pussyfooting around with the massage feels good, however, Deep Tissue Massage is required to break up scar tissue.

There are a number of exercises you can do to help with flexibility/ROM and streanthening while healing. Do an internet search.

 

[Tom K.]

Correct.

No NSAID means NO NSAID's! Tendons need the inflamation to trigger the healing response, all NSAID's will inhibit that.

Use Ice.

My 2¢, Stop taking the boots off when cold and inflexible. The more you keep aggravating it, the longer it'll take to heal, and could get worse. (been there done that wrt speed skates and ended up with a nasty case peroneal tendonitis).

Also, pussyfooting around with the massage feels good, however, Deep Tissue Massage is required to break up scar tissue.

There are a number of exercises you can do to help with flexibility/ROM and streanthening while healing. Do an internet search.

Check on the NSAIDs. Will cease. I've gone very easy on them in any case. I hate pills. I've been doing one Aleve per day for a few days.

Regarding the boots and their removal, I could not agree more. Love the way they ski, but not worth it. And, at home at least, parking lot removal is pretty much a requirement. So, with considerable sadness, I'm going to move on from the Raptors.

I thought that tender spot was a mild pressure point in the boots, brought on partially by the fact that I've skied a LOT this year. It wasn't until I felt a little pop (ugh) that I realized it was something different. Lesson learned, I hope!

Thanks for the input!

 

[Jenny]

Interesting. I've been using Aleve, but not sure whether that's really any different from ibuprofen in this regard.

Also tried some Voltaren gel said a Canadian Connection recommended. No noticeable effect.

Another friend recommended DMSO, but not sure I want to go there!

I hope you healed up well, and I hope mine isn't that bad.

Thanks - I have healed up well, and appear to be on track for a normal ski season (@18 days or so). It doesn't hurt or swell during/after skiing, and I assume the residual tightness and feelings that are still there will continue to improve. Doc said 12-18 months for total healing. Good luck with yours!

Oh, and when I first met my husband (former college gymnast) he was using DMSO for a shoulder issue. He must have been really cute, because I can still remember the bad breath side effect!

Correct.

No NSAID means NO NSAID's! Tendons need the inflamation to trigger the healing response, all NSAID's will inhibit that.

Use Ice.

My 2¢, Stop taking the boots off when cold and inflexible. The more you keep aggravating it, the longer it'll take to heal, and could get worse. (been there done that wrt speed skates and ended up with a nasty case peroneal tendonitis).

Also, pussyfooting around with the massage feels good, however, Deep Tissue Massage is required to break up scar tissue.

There are a number of exercises you can do to help with flexibility/ROM and streanthening while healing. Do an internet search.

Interesting - Doc only specifically prohibited ibuprofen. Others were OK.

 

[cantunamunch]

Oh, and when I first met my husband (former college gymnast) he was using DMSO for a shoulder issue. He must have been really cute, because I can still remember the bad breath side effect!

That stuff absolutely terrifies me. The ability to carry just about anything that is normally blocked by the skin straight into the body?

 

[neonorchid]

-

Interesting - Doc only specifically prohibited ibuprofen. Others were OK.

I'm not the one to defend this, if you really need qualification, my Ph.D. professor of pharmacology neighbor could. I will say Ibuprofen is an NSAID, same mechanism as the others, some are coated to help prevent stomach ulcers, some only require a daily dose but they are all the same group of drug. Either your doctor wasn't specific or doesn't know, in which case I'd be concerned.

 

[Jenny]

I'm not the one to defend this, if you really need qualification, my Ph.D. professor of pharmacology neighbor could. I will say Ibuprofen is an NSAID, same mechanism as the others, some are coated to help prevent stomach ulcers, some only require a daily dose but they are all the same group of drug. Either your doctor wasn't specific or doesn't know, in which case I'd be concerned.

I thought it was kind of weird and tried to read up on my own but gave up pretty quick.

 

[eok]

Kind of embarrassing to admit, but after 42 days of pulling off my Raptors in the parking lot, I've really pulled some tendons/ligaments on the outside of my ankle, right below the "knob".

Slowly improving, but I'm on a 7 day ski trip, and it's tough to rest. Any remedial ideas would be appreciated.

TIA!

Sounds like what happened to me late last season - and it was a warm spring day on the mountain so my Raptors should actually have been easier to get off. But I was in a hurry and my right foot got a little jammed when trying to get it out of the boot. So, rather than being patient and pushing my foot back into the boot & trying again... I tried to just muscle it out. Ended up with a similar injury as you. I also got some bruising and numbness along the right side of the (right) foot, between the knob & cuboid area.

Saw the 'doc & he confirmed a likely pulled/torn tendon. Chose not to do an MRI as it was pretty clear what the problem was. Despite the 'doc's advice, I skied a few times a couple weeks later (with some pain, but not bad). BUT: getting the boot off (very carefully) at the end of the day was pretty painful.

It took 3 months for my right ankle to be 100% again. PT helped a lot. But, later in the summer, lots of weight lifting (building multiple retaining walls with large 50-60lb blocks) and lots of walking/hiking seemed to contribute the most to recovery.

I should point out that my right ankle has always been problematic due to multiple sports injuries when I was younger. It's one reason I was drawn to skiing. I mean, once I get the ankle into a tight performance ski boot it's pretty much locked in & good to go & I can fully enjoy the sport.

 

[Tom K.]

Sounds like what happened to me late last season - and it was a warm spring day on the mountain so my Raptors should actually have been easier to get off. But I was in a hurry and my right foot got a little jammed when trying to get it out of the boot. So, rather than being patient and pushing my foot back into the boot & trying again... I tried to just muscle it out. Ended up with a similar injury as you. I also got some bruising and numbness along the right side of the (right) foot, between the knob & cuboid area.

Saw the 'doc & he confirmed a likely pulled/torn tendon. Chose not to do an MRI as it was pretty clear what the problem was. Despite the 'doc's advice, I skied a few times a couple weeks later (with some pain, but not bad). BUT: getting the boot off (very carefully) at the end of the day was pretty painful.

It took 3 months for my right ankle to be 100% again. PT helped a lot. But, later in the summer, lots of weight lifting (building multiple retaining walls with large 50-60lb blocks) and lots of walking/hiking seemed to contribute the most to recovery.

I should point out that my right ankle has always been problematic due to multiple sports injuries when I was younger. It's one reason I was drawn to skiing. I mean, once I get the ankle into a tight performance ski boot it's pretty much locked in & good to go & I can fully enjoy the sport.

Now THIS is why I spend too much time on pugski.

Thank you so much @eok. It's so helpful to hear from somebody else that did the same thing -- with the same boot! -- and hear how the recovery progression unfolded. The only difference between your experience and mine is that I "finished it off" on a cold day. Otherwise identical. In a hurry. Didn't quite come out. Eff it, I'll just pull harder.....

Can I ask how the affected ankle has held up this season, and whether you stuck with the Raptors?

 

[eok]

Now THIS is why I spend too much time on pugski.

Thank you so much @eok. It's so helpful to hear from somebody else that did the same thing -- with the same boot! -- and hear how the recovery progression unfolded. The only difference between your experience and mine is that I "finished it off" on a cold day. Otherwise identical. In a hurry. Didn't quite come out. Eff it, I'll just pull harder.....

Can I ask how the affected ankle has held up this season, and whether you stuck with the Raptors?

Ankle is doing great so far. I did get some minor aching in the injury area early in the season, but that faded away. I did have to adjust the fit in the affected boot by trimming the outside of the insole a bit to give a smidge more room behind the cuboid area. I'm guessing this was because of some accumulated scar tissue or my body laying down a bit more bone in the area during healing.

The ankle has been susceptible to injury for many years. I had way too many (really bad) rolled ankle injuries in my teens & twenties. So, when I injured it late last season taking off the Raptors, it was a "here we go again" affair.

I'm still skiing the Raptors. Still love 'em. My technique for removing them works well for me now. I don't bother trying to put them on in the lot anymore. I carry 'em over my shoulder to the lodge & put 'em on there. Actually much easier for me to navigate the lot in snow boots rather than hard plastic non-gripwalk DIN soles.

 

[Tom K.]

Ankle is doing great so far. I did get some minor aching in the injury area early in the season, but that faded away. I did have to adjust the fit in the affected boot by trimming the outside of the insole a bit to give a smidge more room behind the cuboid area. I'm guessing this was because of some accumulated scar tissue or my body laying down a bit more bone in the area during healing.

The ankle has been susceptible to injury for many years. I had way too many (really bad) rolled ankle injuries in my teens & twenties. So, when I injured it late last season taking off the Raptors, it was a "here we go again" affair.

I'm still skiing the Raptors. Still love 'em. My technique for removing them works well for me now. I don't bother trying to put them on in the lot anymore. I carry 'em over my shoulder to the lodge & put 'em on there. Actually much easier for me to navigate the lot in snow boots rather than hard plastic non-gripwalk DIN soles.

Again, thank you.

You guys have it made at Bachelor. Plenty of interior room to boot up. Not the case at the Hood River Meadows side of Mt. Hood Meadows. That so-called lodge has room for about six people to sit down!

 

[François Pugh]

I have found that a hair dryer in the patrol room does make the bootectomy easier, as does warming up the boots in the on-hill bar for half an hour with an après-ski Scotch and beer chaser after free-skiing out of uniform.

After much experimentation, I have found that cheap Whiskey (I like Alberta Springs Rye in this category) works as effectively as expensive Scotch (LaGavulin) as far as pain relief is concerned, but by far the best solution for temporary (not chronic) pain relief is two Percocets 1/2 an hour before bed. Up hear that may involve some illegal activity because none of the local quacks (I refuse to call them Doctor's) will give you a prescription for it - even if you have a broken humerus. Your situation may be different.

 

[Andy Mink]

I do stand corrected on ibuprofen while healing a tendon or ligament. When I had a partially torn MCL earlier this year the PT said no ibuprofen or ibuprofen type meds for at least two weeks. That give the ligament time to start healing. Since it didn't hurt at all it wasn't an issue. Ice, ice, baby!

 

[Tom K.]

I do stand corrected on ibuprofen while healing a tendon or ligament. When I had a partially torn MCL earlier this year the PT said no ibuprofen or ibuprofen type meds for at least two weeks. That give the ligament time to start healing. Since it didn't hurt at all it wasn't an issue. Ice, ice, baby!

That's the next conundrum. Ice for the first few days after the injury, but I'm way past that. Heat afterwards.

The last few days, I've done the back and forth thing. Ice about 2 PM, then hot tub at 4. Putting it in front of the jet's turbulence has a huge effect.

Of interest: The originator of the RICE principle walked back that theory quite some time ago. Interesting reading: http://stoneathleticmedicine.com/2014/04/rice-the-end-of-an-ice-age/

He also puts the kibosh on anti-inflammatories.

Really hoping the famed pugski civilized debate principles will allow for some interesting discussion on this topic.