-
For more information on how to avoid pop-up ads and still support SkiTalk click HERE.
All in a picture
- Thread starter Nobody
- Start date
Strike two!
@Tricia
@Tricia
@Philpug
@Draghtguy Kev
@Drahtguy Kevin
@dean_spirito
@SkiNurse
@Tricia
@bbinder
@SkiNurse
@Gary Stolt
@SBrown
@coskigirl
@JohnL
Attachments
Ook, at long last I made it.
Here it is
The more I look at it, the less I like what I see. But, at least now, I think I understand what I must not do.
Camera needs to be lower. And to the inside of the turn.
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2015
- Posts
- 6,351
OK, I'm confused, is this thread about photography, or MA?
It looks pretty good, mate. You're well stacked on that outside ski, plenty of reasonable angles and counterbalancing, even from the hips which is really nice and much better than most (i.e. hips and shoulders level). That outside ski is nice and bent as a result (what is that, a SuperG ski?). A good thing for me is also that you don't have a lot of counter (this being close to the apex) and did not shuffle that inside foot forward either. That's good!
The biggest issue that I see is the obvious one: the inside ski is almost under your body and it takes some weight and balance from the other one. Doesn't look like you're actively using it for support, but being there, it always tends to get some, especially as you begin to release the turn.
It could be there, if your hips were on the snow - imagine that you increased your angles until your hips reached the snow and that's exactly where you'd want it to be...
Think of it this way: when the skis are close together in relation to the resulting force from the COM (see my avatar - they look apart, but at that angle, they're actually close to the resulting force vector) then it's easy for the COM to cross from one side to the other and shift balance as well as balance on only the outside ski. When they are far apart - i.e. stance too wide too early, then you're too stable and have to use effort to cross the skis, i.e. push yourself over. So it will impact your balance (you can't improve it because you've got the training wheels on).
It would be more interesting to see how you got there. It makes me think you were really wide in transition as well and then you can't tip your skis into the turn, but rather cross with the hips and establish inclination that way.
The issue with that is that you spend more time out of balance and you also tend to miss the top of the turn, because it takes time to establish the inclination that way - I somehow think you're also quite tall in transition. The downside is having issues when carving ice, steeps and doing true Slalom turns - should all be a little hard for you, as it would be turning on a dime and controlling speed with carved turns on a crowded slope.
The more interesting question is what to do about it? There's several things... you'd need to try and get more feedback to figure out which works best for you.
You could certainly remove the training wheels, i.e. force yourself to lift the inside ski in transition and it will naturally increase your one footed balance and narrow your stance, as it is very unnatural for it to remain wide when lifted off the snow. Some coaches I hear have mean fixes like making skiers ski while squeezing a tennis ball between the boots etc.
This is one of mine, working on just this (to narrow his stance and improve his slalom). You see this narrow stance (and flexing) it allows him to turn the skis on a dime, but look at how slowly he's moving down the slope, doing pure carved turns. It looks like he's narrow all the time, but of course, when you freeze frame at the apex, you'll see this:
which is the absolute minimum amount of separation between the boots that he needs for that angle.
But again, that looks pretty good to me.
cheers.
p.s. as you work on narrowing the stance, it will mess with your hips level, at least initially. You can't have your cake and eat it too... but you'll have fun figuring out how to biomechanically keep the boots together and the hips level.
The biggest issue that I see is the obvious one: the inside ski is almost under your body and it takes some weight and balance from the other one. Doesn't look like you're actively using it for support, but being there, it always tends to get some, especially as you begin to release the turn.
It could be there, if your hips were on the snow - imagine that you increased your angles until your hips reached the snow and that's exactly where you'd want it to be...
Think of it this way: when the skis are close together in relation to the resulting force from the COM (see my avatar - they look apart, but at that angle, they're actually close to the resulting force vector) then it's easy for the COM to cross from one side to the other and shift balance as well as balance on only the outside ski. When they are far apart - i.e. stance too wide too early, then you're too stable and have to use effort to cross the skis, i.e. push yourself over. So it will impact your balance (you can't improve it because you've got the training wheels on).
It would be more interesting to see how you got there. It makes me think you were really wide in transition as well and then you can't tip your skis into the turn, but rather cross with the hips and establish inclination that way.
The issue with that is that you spend more time out of balance and you also tend to miss the top of the turn, because it takes time to establish the inclination that way - I somehow think you're also quite tall in transition. The downside is having issues when carving ice, steeps and doing true Slalom turns - should all be a little hard for you, as it would be turning on a dime and controlling speed with carved turns on a crowded slope.
The more interesting question is what to do about it? There's several things... you'd need to try and get more feedback to figure out which works best for you.
You could certainly remove the training wheels, i.e. force yourself to lift the inside ski in transition and it will naturally increase your one footed balance and narrow your stance, as it is very unnatural for it to remain wide when lifted off the snow. Some coaches I hear have mean fixes like making skiers ski while squeezing a tennis ball between the boots etc.
This is one of mine, working on just this (to narrow his stance and improve his slalom). You see this narrow stance (and flexing) it allows him to turn the skis on a dime, but look at how slowly he's moving down the slope, doing pure carved turns. It looks like he's narrow all the time, but of course, when you freeze frame at the apex, you'll see this:
which is the absolute minimum amount of separation between the boots that he needs for that angle.
But again, that looks pretty good to me.
cheers.
p.s. as you work on narrowing the stance, it will mess with your hips level, at least initially. You can't have your cake and eat it too... but you'll have fun figuring out how to biomechanically keep the boots together and the hips level.
Last edited:
The American technique is more upright than the Canadian. That is one thing I've noticed over the years of skiing with the Diva's. But some basics are still the same.
I think it is analysis of the photographer, not the skier.
I don't mess with the albums. Too many steps. I just click the 'Upload a File' link button, choose a photo, let it upload then click on the 'Full Image' button to place it in the post.
It looks pretty good, mate. You're well stacked on that outside ski, plenty of reasonable angles and counterbalancing, even from the hips which is really nice and much better than most (i.e. hips and shoulders level). That outside ski is nice and bent as a result (what is that, a SuperG ski?). A good thing for me is also that you don't have a lot of counter (this being close to the apex) and did not shuffle that inside foot forward either. That's good!
The biggest issue that I see is the obvious one: the inside ski is almost under your body and it takes some weight and balance from the other one. Doesn't look like you're actively using it for support, but being there, it always tends to get some, especially as you begin to release the turn.
It could be there, if your hips were on the snow - imagine that you increased your angles until your hips reached the snow and that's exactly where you'd want it to be...
Think of it this way: when the skis are close together in relation to the resulting force from the COM (see my avatar - they look apart, but at that angle, they're actually close to the resulting force vector) then it's easy for the COM to cross from one side to the other and shift balance as well as balance on only the outside ski. When they are far apart - i.e. stance too wide too early, then you're too stable and have to use effort to cross the skis, i.e. push yourself over. So it will impact your balance (you can't improve it because you've got the training wheels on).
It would be more interesting to see how you got there. It makes me think you were really wide in transition as well and then you can't tip your skis into the turn, but rather cross with the hips and establish inclination that way.
The issue with that is that you spend more time out of balance and you also tend to miss the top of the turn, because it takes time to establish the inclination that way - I somehow think you're also quite tall in transition. The downside is having issues when carving ice, steeps and doing true Slalom turns - should all be a little hard for you, as it would be turning on a dime and controlling speed with carved turns on a crowded slope.
The more interesting question is what to do about it? There's several things... you'd need to try and get more feedback to figure out which works best for you.
You could certainly remove the training wheels, i.e. force yourself to lift the inside ski in transition and it will naturally increase your one footed balance and narrow your stance, as it is very unnatural for it to remain wide when lifted off the snow. Some coaches I hear have mean fixes like making skiers ski while squeezing a tennis ball between the boots etc.
This is one of mine, working on just this (to narrow his stance and improve his slalom). You see this narrow stance (and flexing) it allows him to turn the skis on a dime, but look at how slowly he's moving down the slope, doing pure carved turns. It looks like he's narrow all the time, but of course, when you freeze frame at the apex, you'll see this:
which is the absolute minimum amount of separation between the boots that he needs for that angle.
But again, that looks pretty good to me.
cheers.
p.s. as you work on narrowing the stance, it will mess with your hips level, at least initially. You can't have your cake and eat it too... but you'll have fun figuring out how to biomechanically keep the boots together and the hips level.
(@Nobody , If you aren't interested in MA, don't read any further.
)I'm in agreement with @razie on this. I have found that one way to keep from getting the inside ski under the skier is to work on initiating the turn with the inside ski. This way it is on edge early in the turn and doesn't get to act as in 'in-rigger'. When the inside ski is too far away from the outside ski, it blocks your ability to be athletic and responsive to terrain. You can only bend your inside leg so much before all of your weight ends up on the inside ski and trouble really begins.
Thread Starter
TS
It looks pretty good, mate. You're well stacked on that outside ski, plenty of reasonable angles and counterbalancing, even from the hips which is really nice and much better than most (i.e. hips and shoulders level). That outside ski is nice and bent as a result (what is that, a SuperG ski?). A good thing for me is also that you don't have a lot of counter (this being close to the apex) and did not shuffle that inside foot forward either. That's good!
The biggest issue that I see is the obvious one: the inside ski is almost under your body and it takes some weight and balance from the other one. Doesn't look like you're actively using it for support, but being there, it always tends to get some, especially as you begin to release the turn.
It could be there, if your hips were on the snow - imagine that you increased your angles until your hips reached the snow and that's exactly where you'd want it to be...
Think of it this way: when the skis are close together in relation to the resulting force from the COM (see my avatar - they look apart, but at that angle, they're actually close to the resulting force vector) then it's easy for the COM to cross from one side to the other and shift balance as well as balance on only the outside ski. When they are far apart - i.e. stance too wide too early, then you're too stable and have to use effort to cross the skis, i.e. push yourself over. So it will impact your balance (you can't improve it because you've got the training wheels on).
It would be more interesting to see how you got there. It makes me think you were really wide in transition as well and then you can't tip your skis into the turn, but rather cross with the hips and establish inclination that way.
The issue with that is that you spend more time out of balance and you also tend to miss the top of the turn, because it takes time to establish the inclination that way - I somehow think you're also quite tall in transition. The downside is having issues when carving ice, steeps and doing true Slalom turns - should all be a little hard for you, as it would be turning on a dime and controlling speed with carved turns on a crowded slope.
The more interesting question is what to do about it? There's several things... you'd need to try and get more feedback to figure out which works best for you.
You could certainly remove the training wheels, i.e. force yourself to lift the inside ski in transition and it will naturally increase your one footed balance and narrow your stance, as it is very unnatural for it to remain wide when lifted off the snow. Some coaches I hear have mean fixes like making skiers ski while squeezing a tennis ball between the boots etc.
This is one of mine, working on just this (to narrow his stance and improve his slalom). You see this narrow stance (and flexing) it allows him to turn the skis on a dime, but look at how slowly he's moving down the slope, doing pure carved turns. It looks like he's narrow all the time, but of course, when you freeze frame at the apex, you'll see this:
which is the absolute minimum amount of separation between the boots that he needs for that angle.
But again, that looks pretty good to me.
cheers.
p.s. as you work on narrowing the stance, it will mess with your hips level, at least initially. You can't have your cake and eat it too... but you'll have fun figuring out how to biomechanically keep the boots together and the hips level.
(@Nobody , If you aren't interested in MA, don't read any further.
I'm in agreement with @razie on this. I have found that one way to keep from getting the inside ski under the skier is to work on initiating the turn with the inside ski. This way it is on edge early in the turn and doesn't get to act as in 'in-rigger'. When the inside ski is too far away from the outside ski, it blocks your ability to be athletic and responsive to terrain. You can only bend your inside leg so much before all of your weight ends up on the inside ski and trouble really begins.
Quoting and inserting replies from a smartphone is pretty difficult, so, please bear with me.
Althought the hint from Dorybeaux will prove invaluable this coming winter, btw it was a smartphone being used, I was looking for an MA. Yes the RR tracks look nice, Tricia, but it is the how I got there that do not convince me. Razie and Doug are pretty much on it, althought not feeling it much while turning, a lot of weight was on the inside ski, and that is something I do not like to think about it, not to have while skiing. Another thing that I fear.is that the outside leg was pretty much at the end of its possibilities, luckily I had just passed the apex of the turn, otherwise no additional motions from that leg would have been possible.
It might be correct while skating, but not while skiing. Something I have to work on is to try and separate the two sport a bit better, and keep only what can transfer from one to another without generating wrong results.
The snow was pretty nice and soft, what with being on a glacier at high altitude and the slope was pretty mellow, say a blueish part of a red run. The skis are Blizzard WRC piston plate in 186 cm (r21?)
I might try and upload a small video taken on the same run showing short turns, same ski, same day, and there one might see a bitt of backseating.
One last thing, Canadian, American, European....top skiers (and I am not certainly one amongst them) once reaching the summit of technical skiing will ski more or less in the same way (bar minor differencies).
So all techniques will converge at the top of the learning pyramid.
This to say that advices, regardless from "where" they come are all good!
Thread Starter
TS
Btw a funny comment from my coaches I got when "hinting" at that kind of turn while performing LT exercises during the clinic I was attending had been:" c'mon you're not at Kitzbuhel!!! You must ski to demonstrate techniques to your students!!!"
We all had to laugh at that!
Needless to say that I also fell in the opposite mistake, the "park-and-ride" thingy, something that I have noticed I tend to do particularly when tired...nothing new I guess, nevertheless something to keep in mind...
We all had to laugh at that!
Needless to say that I also fell in the opposite mistake, the "park-and-ride" thingy, something that I have noticed I tend to do particularly when tired...nothing new I guess, nevertheless something to keep in mind...
That is one of the best MA pointer I have seen in a while. Especially when that is part a self MA.
Happy trails.
I didn't see that, but that's why there are others who are more knowledgeable in this area. Now I see it.
Nobody, let me toss one out your way to play with "Short leg, shorter leg." Directing and modulating pressure to the outside foot through the arc is high on the radar. Cues and tasks to help are pretty straight forward, but this isn't an MA or instruction thread.
yup. that too is a result... and the solution is to a) look at initiating with the new inside ski and b) what @markojp said:
Project HIntertux is a great buy for you - their talk a lot about exactly what you need. Plus a lot of inspirational skiing... It's a steal!