Thread Starter
TS
Da man stole my poles hmmm two seasons ago, made me ski crud! It's not a bad idea to do it again. The poles do sometimes add another element of "something to coordinate" and my pole plants have gotten weak, too.
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Alignment Analysis?
Hi Amy,
So, taking your comments a little further - you say your body position (in image) is still a result of the prior left turn (image being well into right turn) as 'over-rotation'? Generally a strong indicator of over-rotation is the outside arm/hand back/high/wide open - your arm is relatively forward/neutral position. You're heading where you're aiming.
Your image is really a classic image of pressure distribution issue - pressure/weight to the outside/downhill and inside/uphill ski. Others have noted this, particularly @LiquidFeet. That's why I mentioned the Ball O Foot pressure - one can't properly pressure the outside ski and feel Ball O Foot pressure with too much distributed to the inside ski.
With regards Ball O Foot and oft mentioned Big Toe - i try not to involve Big Toe in an discussion/remarks of Ball O Foot pressure because many strongly interpret a need to 'pressure' the big toe. Toooo much ... trying to put pressure beyond the Ball to the Big Toe causes further unnecessary engagement of the calf and even into the quads - overtaxing when not needed. Simple check - balanced stand in your street shoes, pressure one side Ball O foot enough to feel the dominant pressure there; now try to pressure the Big Toe also... you'll feel what I'm saying.
I'm not quite sure what you are saying "it would open my ankle up so much I'd get thrown back".
My suggestion is to try the simple/hard to do things first - sight/body orientation to where you wish to go ( yards ahead, not directly in front). Better pressure/weight distribution for each turn - appropriate to the slope and conditions (with the help of Ball O Foot). We're all not perfectly balanced and many favor one side - I know I do. That's why the first runs for me are always 'awareness/focus' runs. Do what I know, focus on what puts me in full control and best turns. I leave the Highspeed railed groomers and POW for a bit later. I can drop into 'Lazy' without much effort, after which getting in the zone becomes doubly hard.
...actually I don't do Highspeed railed groomers... I much prefer terrain, areas where line selection becomes a mental game, steep is good - left over from my early decades back east...
It's not uncome to have boots feel 'loose' as the day and the season progresses. Feet can and do seem to shrink after time on the boot. I resist as much as possible buckling down much further. Usually I unbuckle at lunch to help get some additional circulation back in the feet - so they stay warmer after noon. I don;t take my feet out.
If boot liners still feel tooo packed out, there are simple, neutral, non-permanent ways to take up micro space.
- send some snow our way! Mammoth could sure use a bunch more cover until the next dump!
Thread Starter
TS
Well, I had some serious validation for my entire ski life and experience with boots today from Matt at Park City Boot Room: I will NEVER fit into a standard lug boot. My feet measure 23 mondo, 21.5 over instep/ankle, and are 80mm wide. Yes, 80mm. I have extremely flexible ankles and need footbeds with more posting. I'll be starting over--all the drills and technique work in the world will just continue to frustrate me until I can get a true performance fit in my boots. Until then, we posted the footbed a bit more toward the front of the foot, and added a large piece of padding to the medial side of the cuff to get me quicker response when I tip, and take up some volume there.
Now, the hunt is on for a 22.5 (he said I could go to a 21.5, which are brutal small) 100-110 flex 92 last boot. Even with the ability to contact reps locally, I'm not having much luck. Word is that Head (which I'm scared of since I was in a B5, but in a 23.5, and they were BIG, and have an aggressive stance) are moving to a 9 or 8 degree forward lean for next season, which sounds pretty awesome to me.
One of his initial comments to me was that I'm not having alignment issues--I'm having fit issues.
Now, the hunt is on for a 22.5 (he said I could go to a 21.5, which are brutal small) 100-110 flex 92 last boot. Even with the ability to contact reps locally, I'm not having much luck. Word is that Head (which I'm scared of since I was in a B5, but in a 23.5, and they were BIG, and have an aggressive stance) are moving to a 9 or 8 degree forward lean for next season, which sounds pretty awesome to me.
One of his initial comments to me was that I'm not having alignment issues--I'm having fit issues.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2015
- Posts
- 24,980
Read this thread
Cheater 22.5 Boots
I'm curious - what's the point of the cheater 22.5 ski boot sizes? I've noticed that they're included in some really surprising size runs - like the 130 DIN Strider or Tecnica ZeroG Pro Tour (and lower flex models like the women's XT Free . I imagine the woman small enough to wear a 22.5 but...
www.pugski.com
Hi Amy,
SO good that you have further info to define things. A great start point to address concerns.
but NEVER is not an open start point.
And lug boot is not familiar term, other than sole design, as on hiking or the walking sole of AT or the newer WTR type designs for alpine.
I'm more familiar with traditional 'overlap' design like your ProMachines, Cabrio/Mid-Entry/Panel design like Full Tilt, and re-emerging Rear-Entry - not mentioning some exotics...
So, I don't recommend 'never', be open to considerations.
So here's what you know now, 23 mondo foot length, 80 mm width (all numbers same for both feet?), and 21.5 instep (my preferred measure method for instep is from heel over instep back to heel - most used over the years; as opposed to perpendicular from sole over instep back to sole... which was used on you?)
So, was your arch length measured? I consider arch length a critical measurement in boot model and shell sizing.
Instep is also critical in model and shell sizing.
Given your known numbers, the 23 mondo and 80 ish width means a slightly narrow forefoot width for the foot length - not excessive.
21.5 instep measured heel/instep/heel is a slighty lower instep - midpoint avg stats say instep = mondo length - give or take - your instep might be normal/average for women that size, if instep measured close to your 23 mondo.
Arch length would now factor in greatly to make further refinements for model search and sizing.
IE - my numbers
mondo length - 28.4 RT, 28.6 LF, instep 32.6 RT 33.0 LF cm, arch length 21.0 RT 21.2 LF cm, forefoot width 98 RT 99 LF mm
what this tells me is my super tall instep and super long arch length and narrow feet will be deciding factors on model/fit (my heel width also needs consideration...)
Hopefully you're not equating your quite normalish forefoot width with 'std last size' one hears for boot models... It's a mistake so many others make.
'Std last size' quoted for most mens/unisex models comes from mens 9.5 / 10 size - mondo 26/26.5 . That's the '95', '98', '102' width you hear and read about for ski boot models. The actual 'last size' for any actual boot size will vary greatly from 'std last'. Especially variations from mens to womens models. Most HiPro models will be last sized closer to 'womens' width in sizing below 25, for good reason. Your ProMachines in your current boot/shell size are certainly NOT last sized to the '98' you hear about them. Nor would that be true for larger sizes like 28,29,30...
Given a slightly narrower forefoot and lower instep foot (instep measurement method considered) controlling your foot inside the boot is a major consideration. That also means controlling the stacking orientation at the ankle.
I would highly recommend considering good orthotic footbeds to mate to whatever you decide to do about boots.
A good orthotic footbed which takes up a bit of volume might even help greatly with your current boots; given consideration for effective overall ramp angle changes.
Good luck with your quest for solutions!
SO good that you have further info to define things. A great start point to address concerns.
but NEVER is not an open start point.
And lug boot is not familiar term, other than sole design, as on hiking or the walking sole of AT or the newer WTR type designs for alpine.
I'm more familiar with traditional 'overlap' design like your ProMachines, Cabrio/Mid-Entry/Panel design like Full Tilt, and re-emerging Rear-Entry - not mentioning some exotics...
So, I don't recommend 'never', be open to considerations.
So here's what you know now, 23 mondo foot length, 80 mm width (all numbers same for both feet?), and 21.5 instep (my preferred measure method for instep is from heel over instep back to heel - most used over the years; as opposed to perpendicular from sole over instep back to sole... which was used on you?)
So, was your arch length measured? I consider arch length a critical measurement in boot model and shell sizing.
Instep is also critical in model and shell sizing.
Given your known numbers, the 23 mondo and 80 ish width means a slightly narrow forefoot width for the foot length - not excessive.
21.5 instep measured heel/instep/heel is a slighty lower instep - midpoint avg stats say instep = mondo length - give or take - your instep might be normal/average for women that size, if instep measured close to your 23 mondo.
Arch length would now factor in greatly to make further refinements for model search and sizing.
IE - my numbers
mondo length - 28.4 RT, 28.6 LF, instep 32.6 RT 33.0 LF cm, arch length 21.0 RT 21.2 LF cm, forefoot width 98 RT 99 LF mm
what this tells me is my super tall instep and super long arch length and narrow feet will be deciding factors on model/fit (my heel width also needs consideration...)
Hopefully you're not equating your quite normalish forefoot width with 'std last size' one hears for boot models... It's a mistake so many others make.
'Std last size' quoted for most mens/unisex models comes from mens 9.5 / 10 size - mondo 26/26.5 . That's the '95', '98', '102' width you hear and read about for ski boot models. The actual 'last size' for any actual boot size will vary greatly from 'std last'. Especially variations from mens to womens models. Most HiPro models will be last sized closer to 'womens' width in sizing below 25, for good reason. Your ProMachines in your current boot/shell size are certainly NOT last sized to the '98' you hear about them. Nor would that be true for larger sizes like 28,29,30...
Given a slightly narrower forefoot and lower instep foot (instep measurement method considered) controlling your foot inside the boot is a major consideration. That also means controlling the stacking orientation at the ankle.
I would highly recommend considering good orthotic footbeds to mate to whatever you decide to do about boots.
A good orthotic footbed which takes up a bit of volume might even help greatly with your current boots; given consideration for effective overall ramp angle changes.
Good luck with your quest for solutions!
Head has the B5 in a 22 shell. Also, the Raptor 90 RS W and Raptor 90S RS. Based on your foot measurements (especially the lower than average instep) I wouldn't shy away from the Raptor just because of your experience with the B5 that was too large.
Here are a bunch of options for your consideration:
sidelineswap.com
northernskiworks.com
skiisandbiikes.com
SKI BOOTS ( 22.5 ) Head Raptor RS 90 Ski size 22.0 to 22.5 BRAND NEW IN BOX | SidelineSwap
Shop New HEAD Raptor RS Ski Boots up to 70% off – or start selling in seconds. SidelineSwap is where athletes buy and sell their gear.
sidelineswap.com
Step into Adventure: Ski Boots for Unparalleled Performance
Step into adventure with our ski boots offering unparalleled performance. Experience optimal control and comfort on the slopes. Shop now and elevate your skiing journey!
www.levelninesports.com
Head Raptor 110 RS W Women's Ski Boots 2021
The Head Raptor 110S RS is a performance driven race boot for women skiers that want to feel at one with their ski.
northernskiworks.com
Head Raptor 90 RS Junior Ski Boots 2019
The race winning, FIS approved Raptor 90 RS is designed for pro level race rebels with an eye for gold. The precision wrap shell with form fitting micro-adjustment buckles and power strap is loaded with stiff, responsive race flex tuning and balance and houses a fully conformable pro liner for...
skiisandbiikes.com
Thread Starter
TS
Just a quick response as I’m skiing. my instep was taken from heel to heel.
The posting towards the front of the footbed made a MASSIVE difference in speed of turn initiation. Still not ideal, but it’s a stopgap for now.
The posting towards the front of the footbed made a MASSIVE difference in speed of turn initiation. Still not ideal, but it’s a stopgap for now.
What ya mean by posting towards the front of the foot bed?
Thread Starter
TS
Towards the front of the arch. After assessing my footbeds, I need more arch support and it needs to run farther forward, too. The back of the arch is already posted. He ran it from the front of the arch and continued it to the ball of my foot and to my big toe a bit.
Thread Starter
TS
This is awesome. He was pretty adamant I need a 92 last boot. I wish the 100 RS would work--it's at a local shop. 90 flex is too soft. He'd rather see me in a 120 that is softenedHere are a bunch of options for your consideration:
SKI BOOTS ( 22.5 ) Head Raptor RS 90 Ski size 22.0 to 22.5 BRAND NEW IN BOX | SidelineSwap
Shop New HEAD Raptor RS Ski Boots up to 70% off – or start selling in seconds. SidelineSwap is where athletes buy and sell their gear.Step into Adventure: Ski Boots for Unparalleled Performance
Step into adventure with our ski boots offering unparalleled performance. Experience optimal control and comfort on the slopes. Shop now and elevate your skiing journey!www.levelninesports.comHead Raptor 110 RS W Women's Ski Boots 2021
The Head Raptor 110S RS is a performance driven race boot for women skiers that want to feel at one with their ski.Head Raptor 90 RS Junior Ski Boots 2019
The race winning, FIS approved Raptor 90 RS is designed for pro level race rebels with an eye for gold. The precision wrap shell with form fitting micro-adjustment buckles and power strap is loaded with stiff, responsive race flex tuning and balance and houses a fully conformable pro liner for...
This is awesome. He was pretty adamant I need a 92 last boot. I wish the 100 RS would work--it's at a local shop. 90 flex is too soft. He'd rather see me in a 120 that is softened
120 is very stiff.....
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2016
- Posts
- 606
You might struggle to find a 22.5 / 92mm last boot at this point in the season. If you can’t find one in the US and don’t want to wait until next season you will probably be able to get a pair from either Ornello Sport https://store.ornellosport.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=225 or Dada Sport https://www.dadasport.it/en/product/head-en-603600-2014 in Italy and have them sent to you either directly or via a parcel forwarder.
As you have heard there is an all new Head B3/B5 for next year, they are a bit more upright than the current models, the cuff is attached in a different place and the toe box is bigger.
Ornello Sport will be one of the first shops to get them when Head start producing them.
Thread Starter
TS
Not pulling liners out again, sorry! The cords to my Hottronics are getting trashed.
@Swiss Toni, those are the ones! Interesting.
I'm SO hesitant to buy anything without trying it on. I just stuck my foot in a Redster Club Sport (96 last) in a 22.5, and it didn't fit at all. The length was good, but the stock liner left huge gaps, including the top of my foot.
Most of the manufacturers will be at WWSRA in two weeks, and since I'm fortunate enough to be there, I think I'll talk to the reps to see who is getting 2021 stuff yet and if I can try some on (I doubt any of them will bring 22.5s to the show.)
I did find a pair of Lange ZJ on ebay. So hesitant to order without trying...
Surely the forward lean angle in the new Head models can’t be 8 or 9 degrees as @AmyPJ suggested in her report on her visit to Matt. For reference the current Head plug boots are about 16 degrees. Boots that upright would be pretty much unskiable (at least for decent skiers with normal range of ankle dorsiflexion).
Thread Starter
TS
He showed me the catalog--I kind of dropped my jaw! I'm really intrigued by them. They look to have a deep heel pocket and the hinge point looks similar to where my old Salomon XMax hinge point was. That was my favorite boot for balance.
^^^Given that you have a lot of range in your ankle dorsiflexion a boot that upright is probably the last thing you need. Last thing most people need come to think of it.
Thread Starter
TS
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