Philpug

Notorious P.U.G.
Admin
Pugski Ski Tester
Joined
Nov 1, 2015
Posts
23,327
Location
Reno, eNVy

MODELSTAND HEIGHT (mm)SETTING RANGEWEIGHT (g/pr)STANDARD BRAKE SIZES (mm)OPTIONAL BRAKE SIZES (mm)SOLE COMPATIBILITY
NX 1018.53-10160083, 93, 10073DIN
NX 1118.53.5-11183090, 10083, 120DIN
NX 12 GW18.53.5-12203090, 100, 12083DIN, GripWalk
SPX 1018.53-10200073, 10090, 120DIN
SPX 12 Dual18.53.5-12223090, 100, 12073DIN, WTR, GripWalk*
Pivot 12 AW18.54-12229075, 95, 115130DIN, GripWalk
Pivot 14 AW18.55-14229075, 95, 115130DIN, GripWalk
Pivot 1818.58-18249075, 95, 115, 130DIN, GripWalk, WTR**
NX 12 Konect (demo)333.5-12270090, 10083, 120DIN, WTR, GripWalk*
SPX 12 Konect (demo)333.5-12290090, 100, 12083DIN, WTR, GripWalk*
*Compatible with GripWalk in alpine DIN mode only, not WTR
**WTR requires different AFD
Note: All specs are based on information available at time of publishing and are subject to change.


Look NX 10 and NX 11
  • Pluses: Lightweight, multidirectional toe release, easy step-in heel
  • Minuses: Older design but still does the job
  • Color Options: Black, Black/White (NX 10)
  • Others to consider: Atomic/Salomon Z10, Z12, Warden 11; Fischer Attack2 11 AT; Marker Squire 11 ID; Tyrolia Attack2 11 GW

Look NX 12 GW
  • Pluses: Multidirectional toe release, simple WTR adjustment, accepts GripWalk
  • Minuses: Lightweight heel
  • Color options: Black/White
  • Others to consider: Atomic/Salomon Z12, Warden MNC 11; Fischer Attack2 11 AT; Marker Squire 11 ID; Tyrolia Attack2 11 GW, Attack2 12 GW

Look SPX 10
  • Pluses: Great "tweener" option, commonly used for junior race skis; could be the best-value binding on the market.
  • Minuses: Tough to find outside race shops, comes standard with narrow brake
  • Color options: Black, Black Icon (Jr Race)
  • Others to consider: Atomic/Salomon Z12, Warden 11; Marker Squire 11 ID; Tyrolia Attack2 11 GW, Attack2 12 GW

Look SPX 12 Dual
  • Pluses: Multidirectional toe release, simple WTR adjustment, accepts GripWalk, responsive heel
  • Minuses: Heavy, long mount distance
  • Color options: Black, Petrol Orange, Khaki Yellow
  • Others to consider: Atomic/Salomon Warden MNC 13, STH2 WTR 13; Fischer Attack2 13 AT; Look Pivot 12 Dual, Pivot 14 Dual; Marker Griffon 13 ID; Tyrolia Attack2 13 GW

Look Pivot 12 AW
  • Pluses: Multidirectional toe release, GripWalk, shortest mount distance, low rotation weight, most elasticity in heel
  • Minuses: Very little range of adjustment, can be quirky to get into, low brakes can get caught landing switch, no more WTR; you can't get the cool Pugski-influenced Forza motif
  • Color options: Black Icon
  • Others to consider: Atomic/Salomon STH2 WTR 13, Warden MNC 13; Look Pivot 14 AW; Marker Griffon 13 ID; Tyrolia Attack2 13 GW

Look Pivot 14 AW
  • Pluses: Responsive heel, 20 mm travel, shortest mount distance, lowest rotation weight, most elasticity in heel, Forza motif is back
  • Minuses: Very little range of adjustment, can be quirky to get into, low brakes can get caught landing switch (same binding as 12, just a slightly stronger spring), no more WTR
  • Color options: Forza, Black Icon
  • Others to consider: Atomic/Salomon STH2 WTR 16; Look Pivot 18; Marker Jester 16 ID, Jester 18 Pro; Tyrolia Attack2 13 GW, Attack2 16 GW, Attack2 18 X GW

Look Pivot 18
  • Pluses: All metal, single-pivot toe, Forza motif is back
  • Minuses: WTR AFD optional, must be changed before toe piece is installed (AFD Part #FCEF002), not compatible with GripWalk
  • Color options: Forza, Black
  • Others to consider: Atomic/Salomon STH2 WTR 16; Look Pivot 14 Dual; Marker Jester 16 ID, Jester 18 Pro, Tyrolia Attack2 16 GW, Attack2 18 X GW

Demo Bindings

Look NX 12 Konect

  • Adjustment range: 260-377 mm
  • Toolless length adjustment: Yes, w/manual AFD
  • Sole compatibility: DIN, GripWalk, WTR
  • Pluses: Easy step-in heel, easiest to adjust for DIN/WTR, accepts GripWalk
  • Minuses: Tall stand height, heavy for entry-level demo
  • Color options: Black/White
  • Others to consider: Atomic/Salomon Warden 11 DT, Marker FDT TPX 12; Marker Squire 11 TCX D, Tyrolia Attack2 11 AT Demo
Look SPX 12 Konect
  • Adjustment range: 260-377 mm
  • Toolless length adjustment: Yes, w/manual AFD
  • Sole compatibility: DIN, GripWalk, WTR
  • Pluses: Easiest to adjust for DIN/WTR, accepts GripWalk
  • Color options: Black/White
  • Minuses: Tall stand height, heaviest of all demos
  • Others to consider: Atomic/Salomon Warden 13 DT; Marker Griffon 13 TCX D; Marker Griffon 13 D; Tyrolia Attack2 13 AT Demo
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Slim

Out on the slopes
Skier
Joined
Oct 2, 2017
Posts
1,214
Location
Duluth, MN
Thanks for these super handy overviews!

Why is ‘older design’ a con?
Why is ‘lightweight heel’ a con?
 
Thread Starter
TS
Philpug

Philpug

Notorious P.U.G.
Admin
Pugski Ski Tester
Joined
Nov 1, 2015
Posts
23,327
Location
Reno, eNVy
Thanks for these super handy overviews!

Why is ‘older design’ a con?
Why is ‘lightweight heel’ a con?
The heel is the weak link in this binding. It is a single stage not on par with some of the other offerings in the class. Plus it is not Gripwalk compatible.
 

Brian Finch

PT, CSCS, Cert- DN, FRCms, M|WOD Coach
Industry Insider
Joined
Nov 17, 2015
Posts
2,078
Location
Vermont
Where is the P18 GripWalk AFD?!

there’s a part # floating about.
 
Thread Starter
TS
Philpug

Philpug

Notorious P.U.G.
Admin
Pugski Ski Tester
Joined
Nov 1, 2015
Posts
23,327
Location
Reno, eNVy
Where is the P18 GripWalk AFD?!

there’s a part # floating about.
I have the part # for the WTR AFD, I haven't gotten the one for the GW...I need to. I have some 18's that I should update.
 

pete

not peace but 2 Beers!
Skier
Joined
Nov 14, 2015
Posts
1,143
Location
Iowa
can you address the multi directional toe release and if is or isn't on upper models or nixed for being locked in?

Family wise, we're pretty conservative skiers so I've tended to lean towards bindings that offered what I perceived as bindings more forgiving in falls, but then I may be completely off in my thinking.
 

JimL

Putting on skis
Skier
Joined
Aug 6, 2019
Posts
72
Location
Albuquerque, NM
The Pivot 12 and 14 have the multi-directional toe. The Pivot 18 does not. BTW, my new Pivot 12 has the words Grip Walk written on it right behind the fixed AFD
 

JimL

Putting on skis
Skier
Joined
Aug 6, 2019
Posts
72
Location
Albuquerque, NM
As noted in the previous note, I recently received my new skis with my first set of Look Pivot 12 bindings, and read the various recommendations on how to set them up, specifically the forward pressure. Of course, I could leave it to the shop, but I always like to check for myself. Several comments suggested that the setup required some trial and error, and experience to know the right “feel” for the following tests:


1) grabbing the heel lever and wiggling it left and right, it should take significant force to move.

2) tighten so that pulling up or forward on the boot cuff, the brake arms should not move

3) pushing down on the heel lever to cause slight movement, the brake arms should not move


Along with checking the alignment of the white tab with the two marks on the heel binding base, the first test above is listed in the Look manual. So, what is “significant” force? How hard do you pull or tug on the boot, or push down on the lever when you do these tests? That is apparently what you need to develop a “feel” for.


However, consider this. The forward pressure is adjusted by changing the distance between the heel and toe pieces, specifically moving the heel piece backwards or forwards using the two side screws. Increasing the distance lessens the forward pressure; decreasing the distance increases the forward pressure. If the distance is too long, the forward pressure is too low, the angle of the heel piece is too low, and its lip contacts only the rear part of the boot heel ledge. If the distance is too short, the forward pressure is too high, the heel piece is too vertical and its lip is angled down, contacting only the frontmost part of the boot heel ledge.


In summary, for a given boot, the heel-to-toe distance, the forward pressure, the heel lever angle and how the heel piece lip sits on the boot heel ledge, are all interconnected, and as these are adjusted, the relationship of the boot to binding changes. The heel lever angle, how the heel lip sits on the boot heel ledge, are all visible. This is a mechanical system where the geometric relationship of boot to binding is visible by inspection. Presumably, the binding is designed so that when the mechanical geometry is correct, the heel-to-toe distance and forward pressure are also correct. Thus, setting the forward pressure should be a matter of simple geometry. So, what is the correct geometry?


The obvious answer is that when the binding is latched, the upper lip of the heel piece should to be flat on top of the boot heel ledge, so that there is maximum contact between the two surfaces. This is the design center that defines the correct geometry.


Note that maximum contact means that there is maximum sideways friction between boot and heelpiece, so that moving the heel piece side to side should require “significant” effort, which satisfies the official manual test. This geometry should also satisfy the other “feel” tests.


A few posters have stated that the forward pressure is correct when, with the binding open, the boot is inserted and the heel brushes the heel cup, or is at most 1mm from touching the heel cup. A couple posters have also stated that when this condition is satisfied, the heel piece lip sits flat on the boot heel ledge. So, to put it another way, if the binding is adjusted so that the boot heel touches the heel cup, give or take a mm or so, then the correct geometry is achieved.


Hence, the following suggested procedure:


1) With the binding open, adjust the distance between the toe and the top edge of the heel to the nominal BSL of the boot – this should set the distance close to the correct length

2) Set the boot in the open binding. Fine tune the heel-to-toe distance so that the back of the boot either brushes the heel cup or is no more than 1mm from touching the heel cup – this is assuming a boot without significant wear.

3) With the binding closed, the heel piece upper lip should be flat on the top of the boot heel ledge. You can check this by trying to slide a piece of tissue paper between the heel ledge and the forward angle of the heel piece lip – it should go in a couple mm and stop.


I would be interested in hearing comments pro or con from those with more experience with these bindings. Is there anyone with a contrary experience, i.e., their boot heel is not either brushing or within 1mm of touching the heel cup of a properly set up Pivot binding? If not, this seems to me to be an objective, geometric, no muss, no fuss method of setting up this binding. No trial and error, and no “feel” required, just checking visible things – the heel to heel cup distance with the binding open, and how the heel piece upper lip sits on the boot heel ledge with the binding latched. Finally, adjust the release setting on heel and toe pieces, and do a release check. Done.
 

FlimFlamvanHam

Booting up
Skier
Joined
Feb 28, 2018
Posts
5
I get what you're saying with the boot heel just touching the (closest aspect) of the heel cup or extremely close to it. It does appear to be true based on a couple pair of skis I have mounted with Pivots. On one set, the heel is in middle of range mounted for the 300 BSL I use. On the other pair they were mounted for a 310 BSL and that heel is now wound in almost all the way to accommodate my 300 BSL.

I only mention the above because in both instances the boot heel is very close/just touching the closest aspect of the heel cup before locking in.

So there you go.

however, I still set them up so the heels are dialed in to just past the point I see no play in the brake arms when boot is lifted up and down with force (like put a foot in a boot then in the binding and move it up an down). But that's just me and i've never had an issue.
 

JimL

Putting on skis
Skier
Joined
Aug 6, 2019
Posts
72
Location
Albuquerque, NM
Your experience aligns with mine. What you are saying is that when you adjust the bindings to the correct forward pressure, your boot heel is very close to the heel cup. What I am saying is that the reverse is also true - IF the boot heel is very close to the heel cup, the forward pressure WILL be correct.

My point is that a number of people have said that you have to do trial and error to get to the correct forward pressure using one or more of the tests listed near the beginning of my post, but if my hypothesis is correct, you don't need to do any trial and error "feel" tests such as your favored one - no play in the brake arms with yanking on the boot, or wiggling the heel lever, etc..

TLDR.
1) set the heel-to-toe distance so when the boot is put in the toe, the heel just brushes or is within 1mm of touching the heel cup
2) confirm the heel piece lip sits flat on the boot heel ledge when latched
3) adjust the heel and toe setting to the recommended number for your weight, BSL and skiing style
4) in a shop, do a release check

Advantages of above procedure:
a) faster and easier - no trial and error, just set length and confirm the geometry
b) objective, and hence more repeatable

What do I mean by more repeatable? Well, consider the lug nuts on your automobile. You could tighten them until they are "snug," or you could use a torque wrench and tighten them to 65 lb-ft. Which is more repeatable? The second, because you are tightening to a measurement rather than a feel.
 
Last edited:
Top